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Who wins?
Saurosuchus galilei 1 (20%)
Skorpiovenator bustingorry 4 (80%)
Total Votes: 5
Saurosuchus galilei v Skorpiovenator bustingorry
Topic Started: Feb 14 2014, 09:32 PM (2,524 Views)
Taipan
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Saurosuchus galilei
Saurosuchus (meaning "lizard crocodile" in Greek) is an extinct genus of rauisuchian archosaur in the family Prestosuchidae. With a length of around 7 m (23 ft), it was the largest rauisuchian, except perhaps for the less well known Fasolasuchus. Like other rauisuchians, Saurosuchus walked on four fully erect limbs. It lived in the Late Triassic of Argentina. Saurosuchus is one of the largest rauisuchians. The complete skeleton is not known and size estimates range from around 6 to 9 metres (20 to 30 ft) in total body length. It has a deep, laterally compressed skull. The teeth are large, recurved, and serrated. The skull is wide at its back and narrows in front of the eyes. The skull roof and maxilla are somewhat pitted, a distinguishing feature not seen in any other rauisuchian. Pitting is also seen in aquatic phytosaurs and crocodilians, but the ridges and grooves are deeper and much more extensive across the skulls of these forms. The frontal bones, located at the top of the skull, are enlarged to form thick ridges over the eyes. As in other rauisuchians, a small rod projects down from the lacrimal bone in front of the eye, but it does not attach firmly to the jugal bone below it. Ridges along the upper surface of the supraoccipital bone at the back of the skull are attachment points for strong neck ligaments. The cervical vertebrae are shortened and robust, forming a strong neck. Dorsal osteoderms run along the back of Saurosuchus. There are two rows to either side of the midline, with each leaf-shaped osteoderm joining tightly with the ones in front of and behind it. Length: 6 to 7 metres; Weight: 1 to 2 tonnes.

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Skorpiovenator bustingorryi
Skorpiovenator is a genus of abelisaurid theropod dinosaur from the late Cretaceous period of Argentina. The type species, Skorpiovenator bustingorryi, is known from a single, nearly complete skeleton missing only most of the forelimbs and parts of the tail. The specimen was recovered from the lower part of the Huincul Formation in Patagonia, dating to the late Cenomanian stage, about 95 million years ago. It would have lived alongside other carnivorous dinosaurs such as the carcharodontosaurid Mapusaurus and another abelisaurid, Ilokelesia. The type specimen was described and named by Canale, Scanferla, Agnolin, and Novas in 2009 (though the paper was released as an advanced publication online in 2008). The name Skorpiovenator bustingorryi is derived from the Greek and Latin for "scorpion hunter," due to the abundant scorpions present at the dig site, and the specific name honors Manuel Bustingorry, who owned the farm where the specimen was found. The describers have defined a new name Brachyrostra for a clade, to which Skorpiovenator belonged.

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Carcharadon
Feb 14 2014, 02:14 PM
Skorpiovenator vs Saurosuchus
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spinosaurus rex
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For now, I say 50/50.
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Tyrannoceratospinosaurus Rex
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^ agreed. I have a slight edge towards the theropod though
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Carcharadon
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Regarding saurosuchus size,
blaze
Aug 28 2013, 02:31 PM
It could be that is not as big as I mentioned in that post, I revised again Bonaparte's and Peter's skeletals and compared it to the skeleton cast used by Megafelis, given the same skull length, Bonaparte's has a femur that's ~87% as long (I measured it wrong before), Peter's is 80% as long and the cast is 93% as long.

They all have essentially equally sized vertebral columns, lower arm/leg and hands/feet, the main difference seems to be how they scaled the pelvic and shoulder girdles, on top of that Peter's seems to have a 17% longer tail than the cast and Bonaparte's seems to have a shorter tail than the cast.

So, the largest femur of Saurosuchus, at 72cm, comes from an individual:

With an 83cm long skull and ~6.4m* total length based on Bonaparte's skeletal.
With a 90cm long skull and ~6.9m* total length based on Peter's skeletal.
With a 77cm long skull and a ~5.9m* total length based on the cast.

*Since they are almost the same size save for girdles and humerus/femur, I used the length of the cast skeleton as base for all of them, Peter's actual skeletal ends up with 50cm of extra tail and Bonaparte's actual skeletal ends up with ~70cm less tail. Also, this is straight line length, I didn't measure it along the vertebral column, the real axial length should be a bit longer.

I've just realized that, all of my work lead me to the same conclusion as the info on the OP haha, except the weight of course, I've never seen Greg Paul's Saurosuchus skeletal but using the images of the 3D model created by Henderson and Snively (2004) that was based on it, it appears to have the same body proportions as Peter's.

Based on that paper, we get weights for the largest Saurosuchus of:

~700kg for the one based on Bonaparte's skeletal
~900kg for the one based on Peter's skeletal
~600kg for the one based on the cast

At max size, Saurosuchus certainly has the skull to face a ~7m Majungasaurus but seems to be outweighted which could give it an agility advantage.

http://carnivoraforum.com/topic/9666022/2/

On the other hand, as skorpiovenator is seemingly around 6 m long, i would say it probably likely weighed less than 1 ton.

For now, seeming that they are similar in size, i would back saurosuchus due to its more formidable bite. I tend to back rauisuchians over abelisaurids at parity.
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blaze
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A more up to date quote regarding my stance on the size of Saurosuchus

blaze
 
I think I'm downsizing Saurosuchus, it seems Peters drew the femur too small, I now think is more likely that Saurosuchus has a femur/skull ratio of ~0.93 and I also have doubts of my previous scaling of PVL 2557 (the specimen with the femur I previously said was 70cm+), good thing is a lot more than just a femur fragment, it was definetely a big specimen but I'm not sure how big.

I now think that the specimen with the 65cm femur (PVL 2267) was only ~5% larger than the holotype, then there's another specimen described by Sill (1974), PVL 2472, which has a tibia 3% longer than that of PVL 2267 (and 14-19% bigger in width measurements), all this specimens probably fell in the 5.5-6m range.
Edited by blaze, Feb 16 2014, 03:46 PM.
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TheViper
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I voted saurons his because I don't know the size of the theropod
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Ausar
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I've interpreted what's been posted here as Saurosuchus was probably at or near a tonne after all.
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Marek
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As always, a praiseworthy setup, and one which is difficult to analyze sufficiently. Off the bat, I give my edge to Skorpiovenator. Saurosuchus, somewhat typical of Rauisuchians (if exceptionally sized), was easily the most formidable terrestrial predator of its day, but namely, that was the late Triassic, and most of its prey items had diminutive statures. Being so horizontally disposed was obviously advantageous to speed and balance, but larger prey, such as those tackled by Abelisaurids, required greater height advantages if the cranium is the sole weapon. This is obviously the case for quadrupedal Saurosuchus, and is equally so for the stout-armed Skorpiovenator. That having been said, their jaws are extremely impressive, and both could deliver crushing forces, but the theropod was slightly longer, and although I am not the most suitable to speak on the matter, I do believe it had a slightly larger absolute skull size (something Abelisaurids are known for, at least by me :P ). Since the dinosaur (correct me if I'm wrong; I don't think suchians are dinosaurs) is taller, it could simply cease any opportunity to strike the Saurosuchus from either above or, maneuvering skillfully, below (granting it was probably ossified generously on the dorsal side, like Postosuchus). It would be more difficult for the Saurosuchus to initiate an offensive, because the legs of the Skorpiovenator are so far behind its head that they would not be viable targets, while anything else would be out of reach but by a lucky leap. The Skorpiovenator could probably dodge and position itself more easily, only having to rearrange two limbs rather than four.
Edited by Marek, Mar 6 2014, 12:42 PM.
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Vivyx
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I normally vote rausichians over similarly sized theropods. Because of this, I back Saurosuchus here.
Edited by Vivyx, Nov 7 2015, 08:33 PM.
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Hatzegopteryx
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I say 50/50 for now.
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