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Ouranosaurus nigeriensis v Rugops primus
Topic Started: Dec 2 2014, 07:23 PM (3,588 Views)
Taipan
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Ouranosaurus nigeriensis
Ouranosaurus (meaning "brave (monitor) lizard") is an unusual genus of herbivorous iguanodont dinosaur that lived during the early Cretaceous (late Aptian stage) about 110 million years ago in what is now Africa. Ouranosaurus measured about seven to eight meters long (23 to 27 ft). Two rather complete fossils were found in the Echkar (or El Rhaz) Formation, Gadoufaoua deposits, Agadez, Niger, in 1965 and 1972, and the animal was named in 1976 by French paleontologist Philippe Taquet. Ouranosaurus was a relatively large euornithopod. Taquet in 1976 estimated the body length at 7 metres (23 feet), the weight at four tonnes. Gregory S. Paul in 2010 gave a higher length estimate of 8.3 metres (27 feet) but a lower weight of 2.2 tonnes, emphasizing that the animal was relatively lightly built. The femur is 811 millimetres long.

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Rugops primus
Rugops (meaning "wrinkle face") is a genus of theropod dinosaur which inhabited what is now Africa approximately 95 million years ago (Cenomanian stage of the Late Cretaceous). The discovery of a Rugops skull in Niger in 2000 was a crucial breakthrough in the understanding of the evolution of theropods in that area, and demonstrates that this landmass was still united with Gondwana at that stage in history. Though known only from a skull, Rugops has been estimated to have been about 6 metres (20 ft) long based on comparisons with its relatives. The skull bore armour or scales, and other bones had many blood vessels, causing Dr. Paul Sereno, who led the team that discovered the fossil, to say, "It's not the kind of head designed for fighting or bone-crushing", suggesting that it may have been a scavenger. The skull also bears two rows of seven holes each, of unknown purpose, although Sereno has speculated that they may have anchored some kind of crest or horns. Like other abelisaurs, Rugops probably had very short arms. These were probably useless in fighting. They may have only been balance tools, items to counterbalance the dinosaur's head. The type species is R. primus (meaning "first wrinkle-face"). Rugops is believed to be an abelisaurid, and is related to Majungasaurus. Rugops primus's weight has been estimated at 1,336 kg (2,945 lbs) based on a skull length extrapolation from Carnotaurus sp.

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Jiggly Aegypticus
Nov 27 2014, 03:30 AM
Rugops versus Ouranosaurus. The two african dinosaurs. Near a river as well.

Edited by Taipan, Dec 31 2016, 09:50 PM.
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Ceratodromeus
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Iord of the Spinosaurs
Dec 8 2014, 03:09 AM
I personally think that Rugops was a pure scavenger, though I don't exactly know, a Rugops could and would defend itself. I would give it two Rugops. Though I doubt these animals would ever fight. Rugops was a scavenger so it does not "kill things", and I doubt Ouranosaurus would go out looking for a fight with any animal besides its own species.
this is kind of the point of this subforum; whether they would naturally fight or not is irrelevant. touching on your 'complete scavenger' idea, scavengers we see as scavengers today (i.e. hyena) don't solely rely on carrion--in fact in some areas of africa hunting takes ~55% of their food intake.
blaze
Dec 7 2014, 11:35 AM
I don't know if its a juvenile but the skull of Rugops is only 31cm long.
juvenile or not, based on what we have i don't believe it indicates a 2 ton animal, as suggested by wikipedia.
Edited by Ceratodromeus, Dec 8 2014, 05:05 AM.
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Teratophoneus
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theropod
Dec 8 2014, 04:22 AM
Why should Rugops be an exclusive scavenger? How is that even possible?
DP suggested that if I'm not mistaken, but I don't know if this assumption is baseless or not.
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blaze
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I think there have been several papers published on the impossibility of a pure terrestrial scavenger, vultures can because they can soaring fliers.

This is the only one I know from the top of my head Link
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Iord of the Spinosaurs
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Paleontologist Paul Sereno suggests that Rugops was mainly a scavenger, and Paul Sereno is an expert on African Dinosaurs.

Take a look at this:

http://www.prehistoric-wildlife.com/species/r/rugops.html
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blaze
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I have the original description of Rugops, there's no mention at all of behavior or feeding habits, so who knows from where that website got that but even if Sereno said that, he is a paleontologist, one that hasn't shown that he has the knowledge to claim that an animal was a pure scavenger for certain, specially in light of studies like the one I linked above. If that is really Sereno's argument then its very poor and could be easily used to claim all abelisaurids were pure scavengers.

I wonder what could Rugops scare from their prey, it is by far the smallest large theropod from the Cenomanian of North Africa, methinks it was a small prey specialist.
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Carcharadon
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Rugops had a 31 cm skull, this would make it no larger than a lion. Though this might of been a juvenile or something, but if it was, would we have any idea how big an adult would be?

Ouranosaurus would squash Rugops. This is a ridiculous mismatch.
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Jiggly Mimus
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Well thats your opinion...
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blaze
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Well, considering it is tiny, the head is roughly half the size of Carnotaurus, so we can expect it to be about 4m long only, but Andrea Cau has wrote that it apparently is a juvenile/subadult.
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theropod
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Iord of the Spinosaurs
Dec 8 2014, 05:23 AM
Paleontologist Paul Sereno suggests that Rugops was mainly a scavenger, and Paul Sereno is an expert on African Dinosaurs.

Take a look at this:

http://www.prehistoric-wildlife.com/species/r/rugops.html
The correct wording would have been: A site with generally inaccurate information that cites Sereno as a reference for its profile has claimed to be able to infer this based on an absurd argument, without even directly citing Sereno for it.
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The Reptile
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As many doubts as I have had about that site, I still find it to be quite a fun site. A lot better than a few others that I know of.... The fact that it actually cites respected paleontologists like Sereno is a plus
Edited by The Reptile, Dec 11 2014, 07:42 AM.
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theropod
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It’s a plus to cite source if that source doesn’t even support what one is saying? That’s actually worse than not citing a source at all, at least that way people won’t get fooled into believing that what they claim was backed up by scientific data (that’s after all why it even came up).
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Matando Gueros
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Ouranosaurus. The combination of Unimpressive Theropod plus Bigger Herbivore is bad for Rugops. Things are even worst if Ouranosaurus has the claw that other iguanodontids have.
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moldovan0731
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Mismatch in favor of Ouranosaurus, Rugops was small:

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Drift
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Jiggly Mimus
Dec 3 2014, 02:55 AM
I think that Ouranosaurus has this in the bag. It just seems to big for a Rugops to fight. Thats my opinion however.
If Rugops got near it wouldn't Ouranosaurus be able to use its tail or knock it over?
Agreed, it would seem elementary something with that much mass wouldn't be an easy target but it does still have flanks to be exploited.
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