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Why are Great Pyrenees so underrated
Topic Started: Sep 21 2015, 03:46 AM (6,139 Views)
Dogs rule
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Most people here say Great Pyrenees are terrible LGDs I believe they're just as good if not better than a kangal
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Nordred
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I didnt see in action these lvgds but people say that purinees aent combative and so cuddly teddy
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Taipan
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I dont know much about the breed, but this incident was posted a lot a few years ago:

http://www.vaildaily.com/article/20091229/NEWS/912289953

Cougar kills dog in Gypsum


GYPSUM, Colorado - Tara Haymond woke up at 2 a.m. Sunday to the sound of Bubba, her 150-pound Great Pyrenees dog, crying.

"I thought I better tell him to be quiet so he wouldn't bother the neighbor," she said.

She opened the sliding door next to the bed and discovered a mountain lion on top of Bubba.

"There is nothing in anybody that would prepare them to find that," she said.

The 47-year-old grabbed a shotgun but couldn't find ammunition, so she started hitting the cougar with the gun.

"The cat didn't even flinch," she said. "Then I realized the cat might hurt me so I stopped. I guess I might be lucky in that way."

Her husband was home and she also called a neighbor and Eagle County Sheriff's deputies to the scene, which is near the Sky Legend neighborhood at Gypsum's Cotton Ranch development.

The cougar was still on the dog when they arrived and didn't move until the sheriff fired on it several times, Haymond said.

Bubba was still suffering, however, so the sheriff put him down as well at the owners' request.

The deputy was unavailable for comment.

According to John Grove with the Colorado Division of Wildlife, the mountain lion was young - about nine months to a year old - and it was very skinny. Probably it was sick or starving or both, which could result in such atypical behavior as attacking an animal in a populated area. Since this was an anomaly, residents shouldn't be overly worried about any more "aggressive" animals in the area, Grove said.


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Dogs rule
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But a kangal or any LGD can't handle an equally matched fight with a mountain lion
Edited by Dogs rule, Sep 23 2015, 10:31 PM.
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Taipan
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Dogs rule
Sep 23 2015, 10:31 PM
But a kangal or any LGD can't handle an equally matched fight with a mountain lion



I know, but the cougar in the incident above is described as " the mountain lion was young - about nine months to a year old - and it was very skinny. Probably it was sick or starving or both, "
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Full Throttle
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Great Pyrenees employed as livestock guardians in the US have consistently shown that they are ill equipped to deal with large predators.

Now don't get me wrong, engaging large, wild predators is a massive risk for any dog regardless of breed, size, heritage etc. but there have been numerous cases of Great Pyrs being dispatched by lone wolves, and in that instance Taipan posted emaciated, subadult cougars. Meanwhile there are plenty of instances of other more Eastern LGD breeds successfully dispatching wolves, feral dogs and even baboons and a leopard believe it or not.

Now one could make the argument that the wolves being killed by Kangals and Volks are of a smaller subspecies than the wolves encountered in North America, this is indeed true and a point that should not be ignored, but they aren't red foxed size either, they are still large, fleet wild canids that can and do kill large game. There was one instance where three Great Pyrs were unable to shut down a lone wolf and all incurred serious injury, that says as much about the dogs than it does the wolf, three 50kg + dogs should be able to dispatch one lone canid interloper, you see the more Eastern LGD's doing it all the time.

I don't think the issue is all the dogs fault though, I think a lot off it stems from people's perceptions of them. Great Pyrenees are by far the most readily accessible LGD breed in the US, and the vast majority of Great Pyrs in the US will be from show lines. So ranchers who need a serious guardian to protect their livelihood will go and pick up a pup or an adult dog which is likely very temperamentally far removed from it's fully working ancestors, and unsurprisingly the dog falls short off the mark.

I've seen Great Pyrs at work in their home country in documentaries and those dogs seemed shorter in coat and longer in muzzle and leg than the burly "polar bear" types you often see employed on US ranches.

This video explains more clearly than I ever could the differences in temperament and performance between Great Pyr's and other LGD breeds currently working in the US:



Am I saying that Great Pyr's are useless as LGD's? No, there must be examples that perform the function well, but the vast majority of Pyr's on the market today are not well suited to the role, whereas other LGD breeds have shown that, for one reason or another, they are.


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Nordred
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first pic about kangal killing the wolf dont show a real kangal wolf encounter in the livestok..


probabily the wolf was putting more energy in scape and flee by human´s fear than fight this dog.
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Dogs rule
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I think true Great Pyrenees do
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Molosser
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@nordred do you really think a wolf being attacked by a dog will act stupidly and let itself get killed just bcuz a human was around? how do you know a human was around anyway? many ppl would say that about any similar photo regardless. which is kinda silly.

@dogsrule then there's nothing left to debate, you clearly know nothing about either breed.
Edited by Molosser, Sep 25 2015, 12:13 AM.
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Ceratodromeus
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Quote:
 
How do you know a human was around anyway?

Well, technically a human would need to be around to take the picture.
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Molosser
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^well duh that's glaringly obvious.
he said something like "a human was around and he scared the wolf and caused him to run away and do nothing while the dog kept pursuing and mauling it" which sounded laughable. I meant how did he know that a human was helping the dog or scaring the wolf?
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Nordred
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Wolves fall in fear when they see or jusr smell humans....


If the wolf didnt have the human near, probabily wolf could put more natural efforts to defense himself.


Its remember me videos of leopards in the middle of the crowd trying to scape, and some villagers can hitting them on the head and shock the leopards with ease. (but hitting to the head with stick to a leopard on 1v1 is more harder that the situation i said)
Edited by Nordred, Sep 24 2015, 08:01 PM.
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Dogs rule
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Molosser
Sep 24 2015, 02:31 PM
@nordred do you really think a wolf being attacked by a dog will act stupidly and let it self get killed just bcuz a human was around? how do you know a human was around anyway? many ppl would say that about any similar photo regardless. which is kinda silly.

@dogsrule then there's nothing left to debate, you clearly know nothing about either breed.
I own a Great Pyrenees kangal mix and I know that I know more than you about these breeds I've been fascinated by them for years. But I have seen Great Pyrenees in action and they are a force to be reckoned with
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Molosser
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@nordred no human is hitting the wolf in that photo, it's just ridiculous to assume that a wolf would fight less for its life just bc it can smell a human. that line you quoted was probably made up by someone who knows next to nothing about wolves. a wolf will try to avoid humans when possible (usually) but the scent of a human won't paralyze the wolf or affect its self preservation instinct.

@DR maybe you can post a single account of a great pyr doing anything to a wolf other than getting mauled by it. again dogs that get killed by wolves smaller than themselves (even when they have numbers on their side) aren't worth their salt. and now I can smell "ma tough dog" in this thread.

as a matter of fact, great pyrs are probably the main reason why most members here think that a wolf >>>>>>>>>>> dog 1 on 1 or even 2 on 1.
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Nordred
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Molosser... the (extreme) fear to animals can modify the fighting behavior... for example the wolf probabily was putting more energy on try to scape than fight the dog.


I had an wild iberian wolf 5 meters far from me, when i was hide and with wind on my favour. (the wolf didnt reconize me till 5 minutes later... when he know what i was a human he ran away so fast).
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