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Is their a land animal ever that could PREDATE on the SPANISH BULL? (no dinosaurs)
Topic Started: Jan 13 2017, 09:07 PM (7,838 Views)
Ceratodromeus
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Lots of animals could take down a spanish fighting bull, especially the pack predators.
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blaze
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Wyvax
Jan 13 2017, 09:49 PM
I'm betting that a determined Hyaenodon gigas could pull this off too. I mean they were a similar size and basically the real world equivalent of wargs.

Those bull pics make me want steak really badly right now.
Hyaenodon gigas was the size of a jaguar (see), much smaller than the horse sized wargs.
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SquamataOrthoptera
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Daeodon would give it hell.
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Ausar
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Any terrestrial predator around the bull's mass or more should be able to prey upon it. Others have gotten some: "rauisuchians" (e.g. Fasolasuchus), short faced bears (e.g. Arctodus), Daeodon, amphicyonids (e.g. Amphicyon), Andrewsarchus, yadayada.
Edited by Ausar, Jan 20 2017, 06:44 AM.
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Grazier
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Cape Leopard
Jan 14 2017, 01:09 AM
Lions routinely take on Cape Buffaloes, which are every bit as unpredictable and dangerous, and tigers have been known to kill gaur, the largest bovine there is, even bigger than the fighting bull which is a breed of domestic cattle ...
Spanish bulls aren't big by bull standards, that's not where the dangerousness comes from, it's the agility, speed, stamina and aggressiveness/killer instinct.

My view is they are more dangerous to predators than any other bovine (wild or domestic), but not necessarily harder to kill by ambush because they are not particularly big, and cattle in general are not built as durably as buffalo.

I think a rodeo bull might be the hardest bull to kill, being 1700-2200 lbs and being especially designed to whip things off their backs. But the spanish bull is definitely most likely to kill a predator.

I don't think size helps the predator avoid that fate either, the bigger predators are just bigger slower targets.
ImperialDino
Jan 13 2017, 09:36 PM
Grazier
Jan 13 2017, 09:20 PM
Well you're about to be bombarded with people saying big cats will do it easily.

I won't be one of them, but I think lions, tigers and jaguars COULD potentially prey on them but certainly shouldn't be favoured to succeed often on a healthy prime specimen, and the risk of actual death for the predator would be greater than on wild bovines.
Just so you know...Spanish Bulls are over 1000 pounds..and unlike buffalo...their extremely agile and "offensive" minded. Don't really see how a Jaguar poses slight of a threat.
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Jaguars, I do believe (and someone might be able to correct me) have killed bulls. In an ambush I don't see the spanish bull being so different to other bulls, it's in a face to face fight where it's differences emerge IMO.
Edited by Grazier, Jan 14 2017, 05:59 AM.
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Thalassophoneus
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I would assume it to be quite different from other bulls, being a purely artificial breed and basically a "living product" for bull fighting. I mean its morphology alone shows important differences.
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ImperialDino
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hawkkeye
Jan 13 2017, 09:42 PM
Lion males and tigers prey on buffaloes and gaurs, and they are dangerous and bigger than spanish fighting bulls. Mackenzie valley wolves pack can take down bison - and bisons win against fighting bulls easily, as you can read here: https://southdakotamagazine.com/buffalo-vs-bull
Jaguars, big bears and big crocodiles have a better chance to win than loose fighting them, even it will be mostly close fights.
GUARS and BUFFALOS are bigger then spanish bulls, but not more dangerous.

and that arena fight link is fake.
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zergthe
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ImperialDino
 
and that arena fight link is fake.

Do you have proof of that?

lol I gotta say, that account is pretty funny.
Edited by zergthe, Jan 14 2017, 07:42 AM.
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Grazier
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It sounds fairly plausible to me, a Spanish bull isn't designed for headbutting contests with a bison, while that's exactly what the bison is designed for. The anatomy of their skulls alone makes it completely unfair, ignorant of the locals to think it would go any other way. Sounds like the bulls just ran into the brick wall bison a few times and stopped when it was clearly s pointless exercise.

However, none of this has anything to do with the danger either poses to predators.
Edited by Grazier, Jan 14 2017, 08:18 AM.
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Finderskeepers
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It would be hilarious to see a bull fight a bison. The bison would pound the bull until its neck broke. But since this is predators...Homo sapiens if you don't mind.

If you say we aren't part of all that stuff, then a fully grown record size grizzly. Or possibly a record size Saltie. If extinct is possible, then Daeodon. Daeodon is basically the hoofed animals "f*ck you" to the predators that they can do predators better and don't cause they don't want to.
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Taipan
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ImperialDino
Jan 13 2017, 09:36 PM
Grazier
Jan 13 2017, 09:20 PM
Well you're about to be bombarded with people saying big cats will do it easily.

I won't be one of them, but I think lions, tigers and jaguars COULD potentially prey on them but certainly shouldn't be favoured to succeed often on a healthy prime specimen, and the risk of actual death for the predator would be greater than on wild bovines.
Just so you know...Spanish Bulls are over 1000 pounds..and unlike buffalo...their extremely agile and "offensive" minded. Don't really see how a Jaguar poses slight of a threat.
Posted Image


Spanish Bulls are unnaturally stupid animals that would suffer greatly from predator naivety. Lions would exploit this stupidity and naivety with the Spanish Bulls being easier prey targets than Cape Buffalos (the Lions would prey switch to Spanish Bulls).

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hawkkeye
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Grazier
Jan 14 2017, 05:52 AM
Cape Leopard
Jan 14 2017, 01:09 AM
Lions routinely take on Cape Buffaloes, which are every bit as unpredictable and dangerous, and tigers have been known to kill gaur, the largest bovine there is, even bigger than the fighting bull which is a breed of domestic cattle ...
Spanish bulls aren't big by bull standards, that's not where the dangerousness comes from, it's the agility, speed, stamina and aggressiveness/killer instinct.

My view is they are more dangerous to predators than any other bovine (wild or domestic), but not necessarily harder to kill by ambush because they are not particularly big, and cattle in general are not built as durably as buffalo.

I think a rodeo bull might be the hardest bull to kill, being 1700-2200 lbs and being especially designed to whip things off their backs. But the spanish bull is definitely most likely to kill a predator.

I don't think size helps the predator avoid that fate either, the bigger predators are just bigger slower targets.
ImperialDino
Jan 13 2017, 09:36 PM
Grazier
Jan 13 2017, 09:20 PM
Well you're about to be bombarded with people saying big cats will do it easily.

I won't be one of them, but I think lions, tigers and jaguars COULD potentially prey on them but certainly shouldn't be favoured to succeed often on a healthy prime specimen, and the risk of actual death for the predator would be greater than on wild bovines.
Just so you know...Spanish Bulls are over 1000 pounds..and unlike buffalo...their extremely agile and "offensive" minded. Don't really see how a Jaguar poses slight of a threat.
Posted Image
Jaguars, I do believe (and someone might be able to correct me) have killed bulls. In an ambush I don't see the spanish bull being so different to other bulls, it's in a face to face fight where it's differences emerge IMO.
You overated them A LOT. Spanish fighting bulls are completely useless against predators (maybe if the predator is facing them first time and expect them to behave like normal cattle, they have some slight advantage) - but think... Short Spanish guys with swords could kill them easily.
Edited by hawkkeye, Jan 14 2017, 06:06 PM.
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Megasaurus
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Tigers can kill gaur-biggest bovie in the world

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Wombatman
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Smilodon populator, Amphimachairodus and Machairodus horribilis are all at least 330 kg, the spanish fighting bull averages around 500 kg I believe. Those cats should have decent chances of predating bulls one on one.
And then there is the huge mesonychid Mongolonyx, which was as heavy as the bull (or at least as far as I know) and, of course, Daeodon.
Also regarding extinct archosaurs, isnt Erythrosuchus 1,2 tons in weight ? With that size and its massive head and jaws it could kill a bull rather easily, though it wasnt an agile animal and could get gored multiple times.
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Ursus arctos
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Taipan
Jan 14 2017, 03:05 PM
Spanish Bulls are unnaturally stupid animals that would suffer greatly from predator naivety. Lions would exploit this stupidity and naivety with the Spanish Bulls being easier prey targets than Cape Buffalos (the Lions would prey switch to Spanish Bulls).
Yes; for similar reasons bull cape buffalo in bachelor herds suffered around four times the lion predation risk as cows in mixed herds (source). Because of the need to gain weight to win fights against other bull buffalo, the males take more risks to feed and gain weight -- and many of them pay the price.
Spanish bulls would fair far worse.
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