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| Lynxes killing wolves in Belarus | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Dec 26 2017, 05:04 AM (6,442 Views) | |
| Ryo | Dec 27 2017, 11:29 AM Post #16 |
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Omnivore
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I also found it odd that the article seemed to have a wish of convincing people that Wolves didn't really kill or pose a threat to Lynx and that Lynx surely could kill Wolves. I don't read papers that often, but it is next to never I see actual researchers post like this. And as said, I already read this article and I saw some of these pictures many months ago when it was already posted on Carnivora. What I get out of these pics is this. 1: This is an extremely large Lynx. 2: It's a quite small Wolf. 3: A decent sized Lynx and a not so decent sized Wolf meeting halfway. 4: Lynx are much lighter in weight compared to their visual size than I thought, which I would assume means that they are quite gracile. |
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| Grazier | Dec 27 2017, 11:49 AM Post #17 |
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Omnivore
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It appears to be a blog post inspired by this incident of a skirmish between a lynx and a wolf that was caught on a trail camera, with some cases of lynx killing wolf cubs thrown in, all with a very clear pro lynx agenda, and is now being passed off as a scientific article by people here. I'm still open to the possibility its written by someone from this board who is 15. |
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| k9boy | Dec 27 2017, 12:35 PM Post #18 |
Apex Predator
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Of course a blog is not going to look professional or scientific. Look at the other articles on the blog, and search up Vadim Sidorovich and who he is. maybe feel free to send an email or contact him via the blog site if you think hes secretly a 13 year old boy with a lynx fetish. https://sidorovich.blog/2017/12/20/visits-of-wolves-in-human-settlements-in-belarus-with-implication-for-wolf-attacks-of-dogs/ https://sidorovich.blog/2017/12/05/broadleaved-deciduous-oldgrowth-in-naliboki-forest-and-the-main-predator-prey-relationships-in-its-community-of-vertebrates/ https://sidorovich.blog/2017/12/01/benefit-of-semiaquatic-mustelids-from-beaver-construction-activity-in-belarus-and-the-method-to-census-aquatic-prey/ I guess the above articles must be just for cover, so nobody would suspect hes a secret wolfhating, lynx loving teenage boy? where would a random on the internet even get these camera trap images. I dont see him trying to convince anyone of lynx superiority, he is just displaying what he has found through actual research, you know, going outdoors and such. That argument is really clutching at straws. And hardly any actual research has been seen on the interaction between the eurasian lynx and eurasian wolf, only vague statements on website and books about european wildlife suggesting wolves dominate lynx, and not going any more in depth then that. Some actual evidence has been presented stating otherwise by an actual researcher, and its being written off as being lies because A. its hurting canis lupus reputation (its not, but hey some folk are sensitive about their favored animal) or B. the website doesn't look professional enough. again, a blog website isnt going to look amazing. And english is obviously not this mans language, so any off wording can be forgiven. again, these incidents happened in Belarus, and all information above is specific to that area. https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Vadim_Sidorovich Introduction I have been in zoological studies since 1982, Doctor of Biology since 1989, Professor since 2007. Generally, the main field of my zoological interests was population ecology of carnivores and also other species of vertebrate predators as well as analysis of vertebrate predator-prey community in the transitional mixed forest in Belarus. In the last decade and nowadays I have mainly investigated population biology of the wolf Canis lupus and lynx Lynx lynx.  he looks a little mature for a 15 year old? maybe all that actual outdoor research takes its toll on you 
Edited by k9boy, Dec 28 2017, 12:59 AM.
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| FelinePowah | Dec 27 2017, 10:54 PM Post #19 |
Pussy Lover
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Seems to me that lone wolves are fair game to medium sized felines.... Seems to me that lone wolves are fair game to medium sized felines.... Edited by FelinePowah, Dec 27 2017, 10:55 PM.
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| Ryo | Dec 27 2017, 11:06 PM Post #20 |
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Omnivore
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^That is the biggest plot twist I have ever witnessed on this forum. |
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| k9boy | Dec 27 2017, 11:07 PM Post #21 |
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Apex Predator
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I emailed him regarding the weights of the wolves and lynxes in Belarus, the fight between the male lynx and wolf which presumably the wolf died afterwards and asked if there was any incidents at all of wolves killing lynxes. He replied: Dear *******, thanks for your interest. I am not very good expert in weights, but I think an average adult wolf is about 15-20 kg heavier than an average adult lynx (in my data 39 kg versus 24 kg). No lynxes killed by wolves so far. Lynx kills lynx, we found such victims. Sometimes it happens in wolves, but rarely. Here lynxes kill a lot of wolf pups up to one year old, at least. We published book: Reproduction biology in grey wolves: Common beliefs versus reality. It will be online soon. You may see the details therein. That male wolf had litter not faraway (it was case of rarer winter abnormal breeding, another very interesting), it initiated fighting. Before the encounter we registered the male wolf with many camera traps very often, afterwards never. It was a lot wounded in fighting. On the photo you see the lynx is working with the wolf belly. You know what that means. Best, Vadim Scientific blog Wildlife volunteering and trips |
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| Taipan | Dec 27 2017, 11:38 PM Post #22 |
Administrator
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This is the most impressive thing Ive read regarding the Eurasian Lynx, since the scientific recording of two adult wild boar being killed by Eurasian Lynx, originally posted by Gato:
Edited by Taipan, Dec 27 2017, 11:44 PM.
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| Ryo | Dec 28 2017, 12:24 AM Post #23 |
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Omnivore
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I am curious if sex and country is named, since according to the Wiki most Wild Boars don't get above 100kg here. And if they were aged it could mean they were weakened and had become downsized in weight. Tho don't Wild Boars grow larger with age? So I think it depends on which end of the line the "old" Boars were hunted. Tho the largest prey Lynx has taken was 150kg according to the Wiki again, which is also something. But reading this, makes me curious on the hypothetical thought of large specimens of Eurasian Lynx living with Iberian Wolves or even better, Arabian Wolves in a place like England. |
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| k9boy | Dec 28 2017, 03:34 AM Post #24 |
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Apex Predator
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I followed up asking about the the 3 adult female wolves killed by lynx. He replied: Dear ****** thanks for the reply. We registered three pregnant female wolves killed by adult male lynxes of about 30 kg. Two of the victims were killed by lynxes for sure, as to the third one there is some plausibility that the killer may be a wolf, but not a high, perhaps, it was the lynx, too. The killed female wolves were heavily pregnant and clumsy, so their weights are not so important, perhaps about 40 kg including the pregnancy matter. In all the female wolves the neck was bitten a lot and the belly of the females was open for 5-15cm. It seems to be the lynxes applied both bite and claw scratching methods. Best, Vadim |
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| Ryo | Dec 28 2017, 04:12 AM Post #25 |
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Omnivore
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Ai K9boy, would you mind to ask him if he will report any cases of interractions between the ever expanding Golden Jackal and Eurasian Lynx? Since as early as 2012 there was reported a Jackal in Belarus and there might only have come more. Plus, it can be quite beneficial for them to know as much as possible for a completely new species. I would like to compare this to Coyote and Bobcat interractions, except it would be much more of a mismatch if Lynx kill even pregnant Wolves. Edited by Ryo, Dec 28 2017, 04:13 AM.
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| k9boy | Dec 28 2017, 04:28 AM Post #26 |
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Apex Predator
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Yes I can, at a later date though, don't want to keep bombarding him with emails. He's been very helpful taking the time out to answer my inquiry's. As for the coyote and bobcat comparison, Eurasian lynx are over twice as big as golden jackals, they probably wouldn't treat them any differently to the red fox (killing and eating them) |
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| Ryo | Dec 28 2017, 04:31 AM Post #27 |
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Omnivore
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^And even those interractions I would find interesting. A oversized Bobcat hunting oversized Foxes, except for the whole Genus thing and that Jackals sometimes goes in pairs or more rarely small groups. It's just that it would be a new interraction to witness, which I think would be neat.
Edited by Ryo, Dec 28 2017, 04:31 AM.
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| Warsaw2014 | Dec 28 2017, 04:53 AM Post #28 |
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Herbivore
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"I would like to compare this to Coyote and Bobcat interractions," BTW https://www.researchgate.net/publication/257297755_Bobcat_Killed_by_a_Coyote |
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| Grazier | Dec 28 2017, 05:30 AM Post #29 |
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Omnivore
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No one is writing off the facts as lies, I'm writing off his little speculations as unprofessional. If his writings can be mistaken for those of an over eager 15 year old lynx fan, that's embarrassing for him, not me. I'd raise the same eyebrow if he leaned the other way and said stuff about it being "plausible the lynx died". Its like chill out dude, stick with the facts. If he wants to post on carnivora like that, cool, but there's a dishonesty in the way he is presenting his opinions and the problem is manifest here with the way people like you are taking his little persuasive argument as fact. I have no dog in this fight, ive earlier stated its easy for me to imagine there are individual lynx that could kill wolves. I just find biased speculative writing jarring when presented as a scientific article. English being his 2nd language can only excuse so much, he still has unmistakable intentions to persuade his audience and also he is unmistakably trying to blur the lines between facts and research and speculative wishful thinking in a way which strikes me as flagrantly deceptive. |
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| k9boy | Dec 28 2017, 05:54 AM Post #30 |
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Apex Predator
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The statement was vague, so I inquired about it and he says the commonly seen male wolf in question was never seen again after being hurt in the fight. I don't know about you, but I would trust his judgement, given how experienced he is with these two species in particular, and how accomplished he is. He never stated it was fact, anyway. He gives his point of view, and provides evidence. I don't know where you are seeing this hidden agenda. And i'd say its more embarrassing for you, claiming a well known researchers blog is a set up by a teenage lynx enthusiast. And again, its his own personal blog. He can express his opinions how he pleases. |
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