Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Welcome to Carnivora. We hope you enjoy your visit.


You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free.


Join our community!


If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
Lynxes killing wolves in Belarus
Topic Started: Dec 26 2017, 05:04 AM (6,437 Views)
Ryo
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Wops, posted in the wrong place.
Edited by Ryo, Apr 27 2018, 08:41 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Lightning
Member Avatar
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Lightning
Apr 27 2018, 08:38 AM
Posted Image
Posted Image
Dear XXXXXXXXXX, thanks for the message. I may only repeat that I wrote in the post.

"Moreover, we got convinced that an adult lynx, especially a big male can win a fight from any lone wolf. We photo-documented a fight between a not very big and quite old male lynx (older than 8 years) and a (not small) adult male wolf. The lynx threw the wolf on its back, attacking it’s belly. Obviously the lynx won the fight and most likely the wolf died from his injuries. Before the fight we photographed this easily recognizable wolf frequently, five minutes after the fight the clearly wounded wolf was photographed one more last time."

As to me, I see clearly like wound on the second photo after the fighting, but nothing a day before (the first photo). We can not see wounds on belly, but the lynx was evidently attacking the wolf belly and from those the wolf could die. Anyway this very territorial wolf had disappeared afterwards.
Best, Vadim
Vadim Sidorovich replied. The above is what he said.

You know what K9 boy had earlier said were "injuries on the right side and the neck" and Warsaw said that they're "long fur", I think Vadim believes that those really are injuries and not "long fur".

I think he is also trying to say that he believes there injuries on the belly of the wolf although we cannot see it.

Make of it what you will I guess.
Edited by Lightning, Apr 28 2018, 07:35 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Ryo
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Or the fur is just like that due to the mange. But I also would not be surprised that being clawed by a 25kg cat could give you a bad haircut, so that could very likely be the case as well. Or a combination.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Lycaon
Member Avatar
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Those "wounds" look like the undercoat of my akita and jindo when their fur is dead and begins to fall out.

Not sure how anyone could suggest those are wounds.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Lightning
Member Avatar
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Make of it as you wish.
If you look at the part of the wolf right above the part which Warsaw had previously pointed out to be long fur, you'll see that it looks different on the photo after the fight than it does on the photo the day before the fight. It looks like the wolf after the fight has a...well, loss of fur on the second photo. Maybe that is what vadim thought was a wound.

I'm not saying it really is a wound, just saying that part of the wolf looks different on the second photo. So don't go all bananas on me.
Attached to this post:
Attached File The_wolf.docx (2.48 MB)
Edited by Lightning, Apr 28 2018, 10:37 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Ryo
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
I noticed that too, hence my bad haircut comment. The Wolf never returned, so I won't be surprised if that place where the fur is different is where he got some nasty claw and/or biting injuries from the Lynx.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Warsaw2014
Herbivore
[ *  *  *  * ]
Well
http://carnivoraforum.com/single/?p=10048528&t=30236412
Lightning
Apr 28 2018, 07:31 AM
Lightning
Apr 27 2018, 08:38 AM
Posted Image
Posted Image
Dear XXXXXXXXXX, thanks for the message. I may only repeat that I wrote in the post.

"Moreover, we got convinced that an adult lynx, especially a big male can win a fight from any lone wolf. We photo-documented a fight between a not very big and quite old male lynx (older than 8 years) and a (not small) adult male wolf. The lynx threw the wolf on its back, attacking it’s belly. Obviously the lynx won the fight and most likely the wolf died from his injuries. Before the fight we photographed this easily recognizable wolf frequently, five minutes after the fight the clearly wounded wolf was photographed one more last time."

As to me, I see clearly like wound on the second photo after the fighting, but nothing a day before (the first photo). We can not see wounds on belly, but the lynx was evidently attacking the wolf belly and from those the wolf could die. Anyway this very territorial wolf had disappeared afterwards.
Best, Vadim
Vadim Sidorovich replied. The above is what he said.

You know what K9 boy had earlier said were "injuries on the right side and the neck" and Warsaw said that they're "long fur", I think Vadim believes that those really are injuries and not "long fur".

I think he is also trying to say that he believes there injuries on the belly of the wolf although we cannot see it.

Make of it what you will I guess.
I noticed nothing unusual on the belly of the wolf.
WOLVES: Wolves only shed one time a year in the spring months. Wolves will start the shedding process usually around the beginning of April and shed until May and are consistent about starting to shed the same time each year. Most dogs shed throughout the year or have twice yearly sheds (in the spring and fall). Wolves shed their entire undercoat and some of their guard hairs. The way they shed is considered more like a molt and has been compared to the way Bison lose their coat- in large strings and clumps vs dogs that tend to have numerous little tufts of fur that seem to never end, like on a malamute or husky. The contrast between summer and winter coats on wolves can be surprising and many people have asked if an animal was sick due to how terrible and ratty they look during the entire process. Summer coats can sometimes throw people for a loop when phenotyping as well. Only seeing an animal in its summer coat can make ears look bigger, paws look bigger, legs look longer, heads look more narrow but it can also give you a better idea of overall structure without the obstruction of a thick coat.
Shedding and coat growth is determined by the lengthening and shortening of days by the amount of natural sunlight that is absorbed through the eyes. Climate/temperature can affect coat length and thickness SLIGHTLY. Ultimately, an Arctic wolf that was born and raised in Texas will still develop a coat that is consistent with its far north origin. Due to the latitude and the amount of sunlight present earlier in the season, in Texas, shedding may occur slightly earlier than normal- such as the middle to end of March vs the beginning of April.


https://www.texaswolfdogproject.org/resources/phenotyping/what-is-phenotyping/summer-vs-winter
Edited by Warsaw2014, Apr 28 2018, 04:49 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Lightning
Member Avatar
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Warsaw2014
Apr 28 2018, 04:05 PM
I noticed nothing unusual on the belly of the wolf.
WOLVES: Wolves only shed one time a year in the spring months. Wolves will start the shedding process usually around the beginning of April and shed until May and are consistent about starting to shed the same time each year. Most dogs shed throughout the year or have twice yearly sheds (in the spring and fall). Wolves shed their entire undercoat and some of their guard hairs. The way they shed is considered more like a molt and has been compared to the way Bison lose their coat- in large strings and clumps vs dogs that tend to have numerous little tufts of fur that seem to never end, like on a malamute or husky. The contrast between summer and winter coats on wolves can be surprising and many people have asked if an animal was sick due to how terrible and ratty they look during the entire process. Summer coats can sometimes throw people for a loop when phenotyping as well. Only seeing an animal in its summer coat can make ears look bigger, paws look bigger, legs look longer, heads look more narrow but it can also give you a better idea of overall structure without the obstruction of a thick coat.
Shedding and coat growth is determined by the lengthening and shortening of days by the amount of natural sunlight that is absorbed through the eyes. Climate/temperature can affect coat length and thickness SLIGHTLY. Ultimately, an Arctic wolf that was born and raised in Texas will still develop a coat that is consistent with its far north origin. Due to the latitude and the amount of sunlight present earlier in the season, in Texas, shedding may occur slightly earlier than normal- such as the middle to end of March vs the beginning of April.


https://www.texaswolfdogproject.org/resources/phenotyping/what-is-phenotyping/summer-vs-winter
All that's fine and good but would it really happen in just one day?? Because on the first photo, the day before the fight, the wolf doesn't have that weird patch on that area.
Warsaw2014
Apr 27 2018, 04:21 AM
"never being seen again is enough reason to believe it for me."really mean nothing.

Other factors ( heavy persecution of wolves) need to be taken into account . I'm not surprised that " this was the last time this male wolf was ever seen"
BTW here is really interesting info

http://en.ctv.by/en/1516200078-wolf-gps-collar-experiment-in-belarus

http://vouk.by/


Yes, the wolf could have been hunted by humans or it could have run away (quite unlikely since it is said to be territorial) but quite strange how it happened so soon after the fight with the lynx and not before.
Lightning
Apr 28 2018, 06:20 PM
All that's fine and good but would it really happen in just one day?? Because on the first photo, the day before the fight, the wolf doesn't have that weird patch on that area.
And on that particular day as well... not on any other day of the year.
Edited by Lightning, Apr 28 2018, 06:37 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Warsaw2014
Herbivore
[ *  *  *  * ]
All that's fine and good but would it really happen in just one day?? Because on the first photo, the day before the fight, the wolf doesn't have that weird patch on that area.

What your mean by "weird patch on that area."?

Anyway here is wounded wolf just after figth

https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo/licking-wound.html

BT W
Mortally wounded animal rather lying on the ground ,rigth?


"Yes, the wolf could have been hunted by humans or it could have run away (quite unlikely since it is said to be territorial) but quite strange how it happened so soon after the fight with the lynx and not before."

OK
Once again
This is mortally wounded wolf for you?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Lightning
Member Avatar
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
I already showed the weird patch. Look at my post on 12:06am and look at the attachment too. Look carefully at that area of the wolf on the first photo (day before the fight) and second photo (after the fight). You'll see that area is different on the two photos.

Again, the wolf had mange, so even a minor wound would get infected and kill it.
Edited by Lightning, Apr 28 2018, 07:29 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Warsaw2014
Herbivore
[ *  *  *  * ]
Lightning
Apr 28 2018, 07:09 PM
I already showed the weird patch. Look at my post on 12:06am and look at the attachment too. Look carefully at that area of the wolf on the first photo (day before the fight) and second photo (after the fight). You'll see that area is different on the two photos.

Again, the wolf had mange, so even a minor wound would get infected and kill it.
What are you talking about? Where is your post on 12:06am and attachment ?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Lightning
Member Avatar
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Fine... I'll repeat myself.

If you look at the part of the wolf right above the part which Warsaw had previously pointed out to be long fur, you'll see that it looks different on the photo after the fight than it does on the photo the day before the fight. It looks like the wolf after the fight has a...well, loss of fur or weird patch on the second photo. Maybe that is what vadim thought was a wound.

Attached to this post:
Attached File The_wolf.docx (2.48 MB)
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Warsaw2014
Herbivore
[ *  *  *  * ]
Lightning
Apr 29 2018, 01:58 AM
Fine... I'll repeat myself.

If you look at the part of the wolf right above the part which Warsaw had previously pointed out to be long fur, you'll see that it looks different on the photo after the fight than it does on the photo the day before the fight. It looks like the wolf after the fight has a...well, loss of fur or weird patch on the second photo. Maybe that is what vadim thought was a wound.

I dont see any weird patch on the second photo.Where is blood?

Also
"Before the fight we photographed this easily recognizable wolf frequently, five minutes after the fight the clearly wounded wolf was photographed one more last time."



"We can not see wounds on belly, but the lynx was evidently attacking the wolf belly and from those the wolf could die."
Ok the wolf is "clearly wounded " but "We can not see wounds on belly"

So its pure imagination that the wolf is "clearly wounded " because We can not see wounds on belly"
Your photo prove nothing because "We can not see wounds on belly"
Do you have any picture with single wounds on wolf belly?



BTW
Here is clerly wounded wolf.


Posted Image
Posted Image
Edited by Warsaw2014, Apr 29 2018, 03:01 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Ryo
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
I just want to note that dogs as Kangals despite being short furred, have sometimes had very nasty injuries from Wolves which we could not see until we got close to the people taking care of the dogs and they actually showed the wound. There is nothing unrealistic in this Lynx giving the Wolf some nasty claw injuries that we cannot see due to the thick fur, but was bad enough so the Wolf died of infections, along with the mange. It is not exactly because the Lynx actually killed the Wolf, it just provided it with some diseases that finished the deal in the long run.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Lightning
Member Avatar
Omnivore
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Warsaw2014
Apr 29 2018, 03:00 AM
I dont see any weird patch on the second photo.
Well, I can see it. Ryo could see it. I'm assuming K9 boy could see it too (thus, he suggested there were was wound on the right side). I'm pretty sure Vadim saw it, thus saying the wolf is wounded...

If you can't see it, then... I don't know what to say.

Let's put this discussion to rest here. Enjoy your day.
Ryo
Apr 28 2018, 10:45 AM
I noticed that too, hence my bad haircut comment. The Wolf never returned, so I won't be surprised if that place where the fur is different is where he got some nasty claw and/or biting injuries from the Lynx.
Indeed. It's quite clear.
Edited by Lightning, Apr 29 2018, 03:07 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · Video & Image Gallery · Next Topic »
Add Reply