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So imagine a Gorilla strolled up to a gym...
Topic Started: Feb 21 2018, 07:50 AM (425 Views)
Mammuthus
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Hey, so let’s imagine one day a 170kg Eastern silverback gorilla strolled up to a gym to do some weight training, how much could he lift in the varies exercises? (His one rep max)

Rules;
• The Gorilla has no training experience but will know how to complete each of the exercises
• Lets assume the Gorilla is physically able to do the exercises without damaging himself
• Lets also assume he wants to do the exercises given to him

List of exercises;
• Deadlift
• Bench press
• Bicep curl
• Barbel squats

If you want you could also talk about how the Silverback would fair in other gym exercises.
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Grazier
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He wouldn't have the gym membership fee. Couldn't get in.
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Taipan
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Mammuthus
Feb 21 2018, 07:50 AM
Hey, so let’s imagine one day a 170kg Eastern silverback gorilla strolled up to a gym to do some weight training, how much could he lift in the varies exercises? (His one rep max)

Rules;
• The Gorilla has no training experience but will know how to complete each of the exercises
• Lets assume the Gorilla is physically able to do the exercises without damaging himself
• Lets also assume he wants to do the exercises given to him

List of exercises;
• Deadlift
• Bench press
• Bicep curl
• Barbel squats

If you want you could also talk about how the Silverback would fair in other gym exercises.


Can you or someone give us what would be expected weight lifts for a strong healthy human, so we can use that as a benchmark?



This study could be useful:

Taipan
May 28 2014, 03:08 PM
Humans Evolved Weak Muscles to Feed Brain's Growth, Study Suggests
Weak muscles evolved even faster than smart brains in people.


Geeks Rule

To confirm their findings, which were based on analysis of 10,000 metabolic molecules, the researchers pitted people, chimps, and macaques—another kind of monkey—against each other in a contest of strength.

All participants had to lift weights by pulling a handle.

"Amazingly, untrained chimps and macaques outperformed university-level basketball players and professional mountain climbers," Roberts says. People were indeed only about half as strong as the other species.

Looking for an explanation, the team also subjected the macaques to two months of a "couch potato" lifestyle: little exercise, high stress, crummy food.

At the end of the two months, a strength contest with the couch potato macaques found that the animals' strength hadn't declined much. In fact, the scientists deduced from those macaques that humanity's "soft" lifestyle accounts for 3 percent of the strength difference between people and monkeys.

That appears to confirm the idea that weak muscles, along with a weakness for the couch—so conducive to brain—intensive exercises like watching movies and reading-could be our evolutionary inheritance.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/05/140527-brain-muscle-metabolism-genes-apes-science/




Exceptional Evolutionary Divergence of Human Muscle and Brain Metabolomes Parallels Human Cognitive and Physical Uniqueness

Katarzyna Bozek, Yuning Wei, Zheng Yan, Xiling Liu, Jieyi Xiong, Masahiro Sugimoto, Masaru Tomita, Svante Pääbo, Raik Pieszek, Chet C. Sherwood, Patrick R. Hof, John J. Ely, Dirk Steinhauser, Lothar Willmitzer, Jens Bangsbo, Ola Hansson, Josep Call, Patrick Giavalisco, Philipp Khaitovich
Published: May 27, 2014 DOI: 10.1371/journal.pbio.1001871

Abstract
Metabolite concentrations reflect the physiological states of tissues and cells. However, the role of metabolic changes in species evolution is currently unknown. Here, we present a study of metabolome evolution conducted in three brain regions and two non-neural tissues from humans, chimpanzees, macaque monkeys, and mice based on over 10,000 hydrophilic compounds. While chimpanzee, macaque, and mouse metabolomes diverge following the genetic distances among species, we detect remarkable acceleration of metabolome evolution in human prefrontal cortex and skeletal muscle affecting neural and energy metabolism pathways. These metabolic changes could not be attributed to environmental conditions and were confirmed against the expression of their corresponding enzymes. We further conducted muscle strength tests in humans, chimpanzees, and macaques. The results suggest that, while humans are characterized by superior cognition, their muscular performance might be markedly inferior to that of chimpanzees and macaque monkeys.

http://www.plosbiology.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pbio.1001871


Ursus arctos
May 28 2014, 04:12 PM
Ha:
To investigate this, we conducted a series of experiments aimed at providing an approximate estimate of muscular strength in a pulling task accomplished by humans (n = 42), chimpanzees (n = 5), and macaques (n = 6) (Movie S1). The task consisted of pulling suspended adjustable weights in a setup involving both upper and lower parts of the body and conducted in a procedure allowing us to estimate the maximum pulling strength of an individual. In this test humans showed substantially inferior performance compared with chimpanzees and macaques, with an average strength difference of almost 2-fold (Wilcoxon test, p<0.001, Figure 4c, Table S20). Prolonged training is known to increase human strength [16], therefore the tested humans included 16 individuals engaged in regular physical activities, among them five university team basketball players and four professional climbers. By contrast, all tested nonhuman primates were raised in captivity and were never subjected to physical training. Many additional factors including ones potentially favoring nonhuman primates, such as difference in muscle mass distribution between front and hind limbs [17],[18], as well as ones favoring humans, such as motivation to perform, could not be accounted for in our experiment. The inability to control nonhuman primates' motivation hinders the exact quantification of the muscular strength difference between humans and nonhuman primates, even in a highly controlled experimental setup. Nonetheless, our results indicate the existence of systematic differences in muscle performance between humans and nonhuman primates.

Is extremely overstated.
If we assume isometry, the differences are:
Relative pull strength: mean (average)
Human: 2.5039219694 (0.2354953718)
Chimp: 3.3565812903 (0.0662554944)
Rhesus macaque: 2.384192647 (0.218550602)



Ursus arctos
May 29 2014, 02:20 AM
At 10.42 kg, that macaque had a max pull of 35.1 kg. 35.1/10.42 = 3.37 times its body weight.

The chimps were more impressive, especially considering their larger size.
One weighed 41.3 kg and pulled 144 kg, and another weighed 32 kg and pulled 110 kg. That makes 3.49 and 3.44 times their body weight, respectively.

EDIT:
If you'd like to look at the data yourself, a download table S20 from here.
Edited by Taipan, Feb 21 2018, 08:21 PM.
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Mammuthus
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Taipan
Feb 21 2018, 03:17 PM
Mammuthus
Feb 21 2018, 07:50 AM
Hey, so let’s imagine one day a 170kg Eastern silverback gorilla strolled up to a gym to do some weight training, how much could he lift in the varies exercises? (His one rep max)

Rules;
• The Gorilla has no training experience but will know how to complete each of the exercises
• Lets assume the Gorilla is physically able to do the exercises without damaging himself
• Lets also assume he wants to do the exercises given to him

List of exercises;
• Deadlift
• Bench press
• Bicep curl
• Barbel squats

If you want you could also talk about how the Silverback would fair in other gym exercises.


Can you or someone give us what would be expected weight lifts for a strong healthy human, so we can use that as a benchmark?



This study could be useful:

Taipan
May 28 2014, 03:08 PM
Humans Evolved Weak Muscles to Feed Brain's Growth, Study Suggests
Weak muscles evolved even faster than smart brains in people.


Geeks Rule

To confirm their findings, which were based on analysis of 10,000 metabolic molecules, the researchers pitted people, chimps, and macaques—another kind of monkey—against each other in a contest of strength.

All participants had to lift weights by pulling a handle.

"Amazingly, untrained chimps and macaques outperformed university-level basketball players and professional mountain climbers," Roberts says. People were indeed only about half as strong as the other species.

Looking for an explanation, the team also subjected the macaques to two months of a "couch potato" lifestyle: little exercise, high stress, crummy food.

At the end of the two months, a strength contest with the couch potato macaques found that the animals' strength hadn't declined much. In fact, the scientists deduced from those macaques that humanity's "soft" lifestyle accounts for 3 percent of the strength difference between people and monkeys.

That appears to confirm the idea that weak muscles, along with a weakness for the couch—so conducive to brain—intensive exercises like watching movies and reading-could be our evolutionary inheritance.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/05/140527-brain-muscle-metabolism-genes-apes-science/




Exceptional Evolutionary Divergence of Human Muscle and Brain Metabolomes Parallels Human Cognitive and Physical Uniqueness

Katarzyna Bozek, Yuning Wei, Zheng Yan, Xiling Liu, Jieyi Xiong, Masahiro Sugimoto, Masaru Tomita, Svante Pääbo, Raik Pieszek, Chet C. Sherwood, Patrick R. Hof, John J. Ely, Dirk Steinhauser, Lothar Willmitzer, Jens Bangsbo, Ola Hansson, Josep Call, Patrick Giavalisco, Philipp Khaitovich
Published: May 27, 2014 DOI: 10.1371/journal.pbio.1001871

Abstract
Metabolite concentrations reflect the physiological states of tissues and cells. However, the role of metabolic changes in species evolution is currently unknown. Here, we present a study of metabolome evolution conducted in three brain regions and two non-neural tissues from humans, chimpanzees, macaque monkeys, and mice based on over 10,000 hydrophilic compounds. While chimpanzee, macaque, and mouse metabolomes diverge following the genetic distances among species, we detect remarkable acceleration of metabolome evolution in human prefrontal cortex and skeletal muscle affecting neural and energy metabolism pathways. These metabolic changes could not be attributed to environmental conditions and were confirmed against the expression of their corresponding enzymes. We further conducted muscle strength tests in humans, chimpanzees, and macaques. The results suggest that, while humans are characterized by superior cognition, their muscular performance might be markedly inferior to that of chimpanzees and macaque monkeys.

http://www.plosbiology.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pbio.1001871


Ursus arctos
May 28 2014, 04:12 PM
Ha:
To investigate this, we conducted a series of experiments aimed at providing an approximate estimate of muscular strength in a pulling task accomplished by humans (n = 42), chimpanzees (n = 5), and macaques (n = 6) (Movie S1). The task consisted of pulling suspended adjustable weights in a setup involving both upper and lower parts of the body and conducted in a procedure allowing us to estimate the maximum pulling strength of an individual. In this test humans showed substantially inferior performance compared with chimpanzees and macaques, with an average strength difference of almost 2-fold (Wilcoxon test, p<0.001, Figure 4c, Table S20). Prolonged training is known to increase human strength [16], therefore the tested humans included 16 individuals engaged in regular physical activities, among them five university team basketball players and four professional climbers. By contrast, all tested nonhuman primates were raised in captivity and were never subjected to physical training. Many additional factors including ones potentially favoring nonhuman primates, such as difference in muscle mass distribution between front and hind limbs [17],[18], as well as ones favoring humans, such as motivation to perform, could not be accounted for in our experiment. The inability to control nonhuman primates' motivation hinders the exact quantification of the muscular strength difference between humans and nonhuman primates, even in a highly controlled experimental setup. Nonetheless, our results indicate the existence of systematic differences in muscle performance between humans and nonhuman primates.

Is extremely overstated.
If we assume isometry, the differences are:
Relative pull strength: mean (average)
Human: 2.5039219694 (0.2354953718)
Chimp: 3.3565812903 (0.0662554944)
Rhesus macaque: 2.384192647 (0.218550602)



Ursus arctos
May 29 2014, 02:20 AM
At 10.42 kg, that macaque had a max pull of 35.1 kg. 35.1/10.42 = 3.37 times its body weight.

The chimps were more impressive, especially considering their larger size.
One weighed 41.3 kg and pulled 144 kg, and another weighed 32 kg and pulled 110 kg. That makes 3.49 and 3.44 times their body weight, respectively.

EDIT:
If you'd like to look at the data yourself, a download table S20 from here.
A strong man of around 90kg should be able to do this:

Bench press - 310-320lbs
Deadlift - 450 lbs
Bicep curl - 150-160lbs
Barbel squats - 430lbs

(these would be the 1 rep maxes btw and the Gorilla got a 1 month gym pass so we good to go lol)
Edited by Mammuthus, Feb 21 2018, 08:36 PM.
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K9 Bite
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Not sure how the gorilla would fair in barbel squats...considering their legs are shorter in proportion to their arms. Any sources about the strength of a Gorilla's legs? Also I think i heard somewhere on this forum about humans having better abdominal strength than most other primates. If that's so, then it might be a factor that'll work against the gorilla in some exercises, especially if he decided he wants to do curl ups next haha.
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Meancat
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Feb 22 2018, 02:20 AM
Not sure how the gorilla would fair in barbel squats...considering their legs are shorter in proportion to their arms. Any sources about the strength of a Gorilla's legs? Also I think i heard somewhere on this forum about humans having better abdominal strength than most other primates. If that's so, then it might be a factor that'll work against the gorilla in some exercises, especially if he decided he wants to do curl ups next haha.
Bonobo legs are twice as strong as human legs proportionate to size. "A 2006 study found that bonobos can jump one-third higher than top-level human athletes, and bonobo legs generate as much force as humans nearly two times heavier." http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2009/02/how_strong_is_a_chimpanzee.html
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