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Protoceratops andrewsi v Velociraptor mongoliensis
Topic Started: Jan 6 2012, 08:43 PM (9,976 Views)
Taipan
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Velociraptor mongoliensis
Velociraptor ( /vɨˈlɒsɨræptər/; meaning 'swift seizer')[1] is a genus of dromaeosaurid theropod dinosaur that existed approximately 75 to 71 million years ago during the later part of the Cretaceous Period. Two species are currently recognized, although others have been assigned in the past. The type species is V. mongoliensis; fossils of this species have been discovered in Mongolia. Smaller than other dromaeosaurids like Deinonychus and Achillobator, Velociraptor nevertheless shared many of the same anatomical features. It was a bipedal, feathered carnivore with a long, stiffened tail and an enlarged sickle-shaped claw on each hindfoot, which is thought to have been used to kill its prey. Velociraptor can be distinguished from other dromaeosaurids by its long and low skull, with an upturned snout. Velociraptor was a mid-sized dromaeosaurid, with adults measuring up to 2.07 m (6.8 ft) long, 0.5 m (1.6 ft) high at the hip, and weighing up to 15 kg (33 lb). The skull, which grew up to 25 cm (9.8 in) long, was uniquely up-curved, concave on the upper surface and convex on the lower. The jaws were lined with 26–28 widely spaced teeth on each side, each more strongly serrated on the back edge than the front—possibly an adaptation that improved its ability to catch and hold fast-moving prey.

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Protoceratops andrewsi
Protoceratops ( /ˌproʊtoʊˈsɛrətɒps/; from Greek proto-/πρωτο- "first", cerat-/κερατ- "horn" and -ops/-ωψ "face", meaning "First Horned Face") is a genus of sheep-sized (1.5 to 2 m long) herbivorous ceratopsian dinosaur, from the Upper Cretaceous Period (Campanian stage) of what is now Mongolia. It was a member of the Protoceratopsidae, a group of early horned dinosaurs. Unlike later ceratopsians, however, it was a much smaller creature that lacked well-developed horns and retained some primitive traits not seen in later genera. Protoceratops had a large neck frill, which may have served to protect the neck, to anchor jaw muscles, to impress other members of the species, or combinations of these functions. Described by Walter Granger and W.K. Gregory in 1923, Protoceratops was initially believed to be an ancestor of the North American ceratopsians. Protoceratops was approximately 1.8 meters (6 ft) in length and 0.6 meters (2 ft) high at the shoulder. A fully grown adult would have weighed less than 400 pounds (180 kg). The large numbers of specimens found in high concentration suggest that Protoceratops lived in herds.

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Edited by Taipan, Oct 15 2017, 01:33 PM.
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Drift
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Protoceratops can really only bite and if it's got no chance to grab up a Raptor limb in close range, it's done for.I see it being pounced on and slashed.
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theropod
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Oh, so now suddenly the bite is not the deciding factor any more? lol

Yes, Protoceratops will likely rely on its bite, but it is also just way more powerful than its opponent due to being way heavier.
Added to that, being a ceratopsian it was a relatively nimble animal, despite its bulky head. A bite by this creature would be absolutely devastating to a lightly built animal like Velociraptor, and if it wants to attack it, it cannot avoid going to close quarters where it is at a serious risk of just being overpowered and making that experiance first hand.

imo the morphology of ceratopsians makes attacking them without inviting a counterstrike very difficult, since their morphology allows them to turn quickly and their bodys are very compact. This makes it difficult for any predator to avoid coming into range of that beak (or the horns) while attacking.
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Black Ice
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Teratophoneus
Nov 9 2013, 06:08 AM
That Protoceratops immy is ugly, here's a better one:

Posted Image

Wouldn't be nice if we use this image for Protoceratops' match from now?

However

Protoceratops win for the motivation stated above.

That proto is hideous. Look like a literal piece of shit.
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spinosaurus rex
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More like an elongated owl pellet
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retic
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i favor protoceratops because of its size and strength advantage. it also has a frill for protection.
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theropod
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Teratophoneus
Nov 9 2013, 06:08 AM
That Protoceratops immy is ugly, here's a better one:

Posted Image

Wouldn't be nice if we use this image for Protoceratops' match from now?

Agreed!
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Vobby
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I like that picture, but I think it would be better for now to limit the quills at the tail zone, more or less like here:

http://jasonbrougham.com/behavioral-reconstructions-3/#jp-carousel-302

Also, @theropod, I've nothing against you claim about ceratopsian being nimble and good turners, I kinda agree, but which is your source for it? Onlu that documentary which made T.rex fighting a Triceratops?

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Black Ice
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Vobby
Jun 9 2014, 09:42 AM
I like that picture, but I think it would be better for now to limit the quills at the tail zone, more or less like here:

http://jasonbrougham.com/behavioral-reconstructions-3/#jp-carousel-302

Also, @theropod, I've nothing against you claim about ceratopsian being nimble and good turners, I kinda agree, but which is your source for it? Onlu that documentary which made T.rex fighting a Triceratops?

That reconstruction looks far more realistic for a desert dwelling animal.
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theropod
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Vobby
Jun 9 2014, 09:42 AM
I like that picture, but I think it would be better for now to limit the quills at the tail zone, more or less like here:

http://jasonbrougham.com/behavioral-reconstructions-3/#jp-carousel-302

Also, @theropod, I've nothing against you claim about ceratopsian being nimble and good turners, I kinda agree, but which is your source for it? Onlu that documentary which made T.rex fighting a Triceratops?

A documentary? I’ve seen the Truth About Killer Dinosaurs in case that”s what you mean (I even enjoyed it for the most part), but that was not what led me to this conclusion.

For the most part simple physical principles, a quadruped can more easily excert torque and is inherently more stable, and a ceratopsian is very compact, with a low profile.
Since their limbs also aren’t graviportal but fairly robust, and their locomotive abilities are regarded as comparable to those of rhinos (Paul 2000) I considered "nimble" the right term to describe its mobility. It is not sluggish, slow and unagile like perhaps a crocodile would be on land.

Velociraptor would not have an easy time outmaneuvering Protoceratops to come past its potent defenses (even though it could most certainly best it in terms of acrobatic capabilities), and even then there are ways in which I see the ceratopsian using its strenght and bulk advantage to dislodge and kill it.
That makes me quite confident that Protoceratops would be powerful enough to dispatch the drom in a fighting-dinosaurs-situation

I’ve got nothing against the image you posted, actually I like it even better than the other one, even though I see no particular reason why all ceratopsians should have had filaments just on theit tail region (to porcupines have them just on their hindquarters). I merely think the one in the OP is hideous.
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Jinfengopteryx
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Accurate or not, I don't the one in the OP hideous at all, maybe because I saw it so often. I still find it inaccurate though. Anyway, as BlackIce said, such a look would make perfect sense for a desert animal maybe other ceratopsians had more filaments. But you're right that they could have given it a bit more body cover.
Edited by Jinfengopteryx, Jun 9 2014, 07:57 PM.
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Taipan
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Teratophoneus
Nov 9 2013, 06:08 AM
That Protoceratops immy is ugly, here's a better one:

Posted Image

Wouldn't be nice if we use this image for Protoceratops' match from now?




^ That Protoceratops immy is uglier.

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theropod
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@jingoferx: Homeothermic desert animals (camels for example) can actually have thick fur, serving as insulation against excessive heat. But Protoceratops’ habitat wasn’t necessarily a desert.
If so, that might actually be an argument for thick insulation, to reduce both overheating during the day and heat loss during the night.
Edited by theropod, Jun 9 2014, 08:51 PM.
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One to one protoceratop wins easyliy due to huge size advantage imo.
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Spinosuchus
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Theropod is right on... The protoceratops is simply a much bulkier and more robust animal than the theropod (in general, the same can be said about ceratopsia compared to dromeosauridae; dromeosaurids were not largely robust), and the latter would have far too many problems attacking it head-on without getting seriously injured through powerful biting of the herbivore, for a lack of better words
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Megasaurus
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Yes protoceratops has size advantage.
This fossil-Velociraptor has chance but protoceratops probadly wins


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