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Spinosaurus aegyptiacus v Tyrannosaurus rex
Topic Started: Jan 7 2012, 02:16 AM (459,277 Views)
Wolf Eagle
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Tyrannosaurus rex
Tyrannosaurus is a genus of coelurosaurian theropod dinosaur. The species Tyrannosaurus rex (rex meaning "king" in Latin), commonly abbreviated to T. rex, is a fixture in popular culture. It lived throughout what is now western North America, with a much wider range than other tyrannosaurids. Fossils are found in a variety of rock formations dating to the Maastrichtian age of the upper Cretaceous Period, 67 to 65.5 million years ago.[1] It was among the last non-avian dinosaurs to exist before the Cretaceous–Paleogene extinction event. Like other tyrannosaurids, Tyrannosaurus was a bipedal carnivore with a massive skull balanced by a long, heavy tail. Relative to the large and powerful hindlimbs, Tyrannosaurus forelimbs were small, though unusually powerful for their size, and bore two clawed digits. Although other theropods rivaled or exceeded Tyrannosaurus rex in size, it was the largest known tyrannosaurid and one of the largest known land predators. By far the largest carnivore in its environment, Tyrannosaurus rex may have been an apex predator, preying upon hadrosaurs and ceratopsians, although some experts have suggested it was primarily a scavenger. The debate over Tyrannosaurus as apex predator or scavenger is among the longest running in paleontology. Tyrannosaurus rex was one of the largest land carnivores of all time; the largest complete specimen, FMNH PR2081 ("Sue"), measured 12.8 metres (42 ft) long, and was 4.0 metres (13.1 ft) tall at the hips. Mass estimates have varied widely over the years, from more than 7.2 metric tons (7.9 short tons), to less than 4.5 metric tons (5.0 short tons), with most modern estimates ranging between 5.4 and 6.8 metric tons (6.0 and 7.5 short tons). Packard et al. (2009) tested dinosaur mass estimation procedures on elephants and concluded that dinosaur estimations are flawed and produce over-estimations; thus, the weight of Tyrannosaurus could be much less than usually estimated. Other estimations have concluded that the largest known Tyrannosaurus specimens had a weight exceeding 9 tonnes.

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Spinosaurus aegyptiacus
Spinosaurus is a genus of theropod dinosaur which lived in what is now North Africa, from the lower Albian to lower Cenomanian stages of the Cretaceous period, about 112 to 97 million years ago. Spinosaurus may be the largest of all known carnivorous dinosaurs, even larger than Tyrannosaurus and Giganotosaurus. Estimates published in 2005 and 2007 suggest that it was 12.6 to 18 metres (41 to 59 ft) in length and 7 to 20.9 tonnes (7.7 to 23.0 short tons) in weight. The skull of Spinosaurus was long and narrow like that of a modern crocodilian. Spinosaurus is thought to have eaten fish; evidence suggests that it lived both on land and in water like a modern crocodilian. The distinctive spines of Spinosaurus, which were long extensions of the vertebrae, grew to at least 1.65 meters (5.4 ft) long and were likely to have had skin connecting them, forming a sail-like structure, although some authors have suggested that the spines were covered in fat and formed a hump. Multiple functions have been put forward for this structure, including thermoregulation and display. Dal Sasso et al. (2005) assumed that Spinosaurus and Suchomimus had the same body proportions in relation to their skull lengths, and thereby calculated that Spinosaurus was 16 to 18 meters (52 to 59 ft) in length and 7 to 9 tonnes (7.7 to 9.9 short tons) in weight. The Dal Sasso et al. estimates were criticized because the skull length estimate was uncertain, and (assuming that body mass increases as the cube of body length) scaling Suchomimus which was 11 meters (36 ft) long and 3.8 tonnes (4.2 short tons) in mass to the range of estimated lengths of Spinosaurus would produce an estimated body mass of 11.7 to 16.7 tonnes (12.9 to 18.4 short tons).

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Edited by Taipan, Apr 24 2015, 10:10 PM.
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Godzillasaurus
Reptile King
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MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 10:37 AM
It has the power in its body to easily control and push a teensy little 6 ton rex around.
Teensy? You are talking about a dinosaur with one of the largest bite forces in all of history! Livescience.com states that the posterior area of the mandible of an adult tyrannosaurus may range from around 7,000 pounds to around 13,000 pounds of force. Here is the article in case you are interested: Tyrannosaurus Bite Force
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Superiron21
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Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 09:33 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 04:44 AM
Superiron21
Jan 24 2013, 04:30 AM
brolyeuphyfusion
Jan 23 2013, 12:12 PM
Superiron21
Jan 23 2013, 09:53 AM
Jinfengopteryx
Jan 23 2013, 04:38 AM
brolyeuphyfusion
Jan 22 2013, 07:46 PM
Their comparative dentary sizes are irrelevant as it doesn't actually prove anything in this match...
Not in this match, but they have an estimate debate and Verdugo has critisized theropods reconstruction, because he claimed the dentary to be too long in theropods skull reconstruction. Skull size matters a lot in this fight, as it could help to determine the size of Spinosaurus, with scaling up from it's relatives (you know that a size advantage would be important for Spinosaurus). Skull size would be important aswell for bite force, tough in bite force Tyrannosaurus anyway wins with ease, but Spinosaurus would still need at least a bite force strong enough to kill Tyrannosaurus. Also, Tyrannosaurus being more bird like is very irrelevant, Verdugo just said the Tyrannosaurus thing for comparision, to show how big the dentary size he believes in would be.
I´m with you on that.... and by the way many scientists said that the bite force of spino was not designed for fighting (catching fish and preys really smaller comapring with it´s size) their hands are not so powerful they´re designed (even the claw to catch fishes and squeeze prey althought his claws could do damage ... yes but not mortal wonds to the robust body of t-rex.....
I´ve seen from a real expert a good explanation (push your 3rd finger with your first finge (spino bite) then push all the hand (T-rex bite)... If T-rex catch spino´s neck there won´t be coming back..... no matter it´s size
Would you just stop with the bias? You're not looking at Spinosaurus' advantages...what makes you think that this would be a biting contest!? Spinosaurus would overpower and kill the Tyrannosaurus with it's size and strength...
I you don´t see the truth is your problem size is not the same as strenght (I´m not saying this, experts said)... spino was not stronger than t-rex even carcha was strongest than spino... but keep in your fantasy world the only advantage I see is size but only to intimidation no to fight...
Think of it this way. Let's say Tyrannosaurus is a Jaguar, and Spinosaurus is a leopard, both weighing 250lbs. Of course the Jag is quite a bit stronger. Now imagine Tyranno is a 250lb Jag, and Spino is a 500lb leopard. Now, when factoring in the size advantage, you can easily see why spinosaurus would be far stronger in absolute terms than Tyrannosaurus.

For instance, Spinosaurus would be able to lift,carry,push,move, much heavier objects that Tyrannosaurus. Pushing moving is with body, not arms, although Spinosaurus has the advantage there too.
Spinosaurus may have been stronger than tyrannosaurus when much larger and heavier, but tyrannosaurus is more powerful pound for pound. I do see what you are saying.
thanks... one pal that know what I´m talking about--
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Superiron21
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theropod
Jan 24 2013, 07:58 AM
regarding my reconstruction, only the known parts are of course certain, and how they scale is a different question. carcha is fairly complete, sue is complete but crushed and the top view might not be totally accurate but gives a good impression of its width. spino is a real problem as we don't even know how exactly the dentary matches the rostrum and the other fragments. the whole posterior cranium is speculative and based on relatives, so it might have been completely different. however neither irritator nor suchomimus seem to have had a wider cranium. Its possible that having a wider snout, the posterior part of spinosaurus was too more expanded, you could use your imagination there. The rest is based on Suchomimus and irritator and while not factual as good as any other guess.
Certainly it was in any case by far narrower than t.rex's skull.
First thing I totally agree with you... GOOD JOB MAN....
but I have a question... carcharodontosaurus skull is not just a maxila and sereno´s had been reconstructed a little oversized? according to real data what are the measurements of the carcharodontosaurus most complete?
Edited by Superiron21, Jan 24 2013, 11:01 AM.
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MightyMaus
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Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 10:46 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 10:37 AM
It has the power in its body to easily control and push a teensy little 6 ton rex around.
Teensy? You are talking about a dinosaur with one of the largest bite forces in all of history! Livescience.com states that the posterior area of the mandible of an adult tyrannosaurus may range from around 7,000 pounds to around 13,000 pounds of force. Here is the article in case you are interested: [url=/18718-trex-strong-bite.html]Tyrannosaurus Bite Force[/url]
Everything about Tyrannosaurus is small compared to Spinosaurus, except for its bite. I'll give you a scale....

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SpinoInWonderland
The madness has come back...
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Superiron21
Jan 24 2013, 04:30 AM
brolyeuphyfusion
Jan 23 2013, 12:12 PM
Superiron21
Jan 23 2013, 09:53 AM
Jinfengopteryx
Jan 23 2013, 04:38 AM
brolyeuphyfusion
Jan 22 2013, 07:46 PM
Their comparative dentary sizes are irrelevant as it doesn't actually prove anything in this match...
Not in this match, but they have an estimate debate and Verdugo has critisized theropods reconstruction, because he claimed the dentary to be too long in theropods skull reconstruction. Skull size matters a lot in this fight, as it could help to determine the size of Spinosaurus, with scaling up from it's relatives (you know that a size advantage would be important for Spinosaurus). Skull size would be important aswell for bite force, tough in bite force Tyrannosaurus anyway wins with ease, but Spinosaurus would still need at least a bite force strong enough to kill Tyrannosaurus. Also, Tyrannosaurus being more bird like is very irrelevant, Verdugo just said the Tyrannosaurus thing for comparision, to show how big the dentary size he believes in would be.
I´m with you on that.... and by the way many scientists said that the bite force of spino was not designed for fighting (catching fish and preys really smaller comapring with it´s size) their hands are not so powerful they´re designed (even the claw to catch fishes and squeeze prey althought his claws could do damage ... yes but not mortal wonds to the robust body of t-rex.....
I´ve seen from a real expert a good explanation (push your 3rd finger with your first finge (spino bite) then push all the hand (T-rex bite)... If T-rex catch spino´s neck there won´t be coming back..... no matter it´s size
Would you just stop with the bias? You're not looking at Spinosaurus' advantages...what makes you think that this would be a biting contest!? Spinosaurus would overpower and kill the Tyrannosaurus with it's size and strength...
I you don´t see the truth is your problem size is not the same as strenght (I´m not saying this, experts said)... spino was not stronger than t-rex even carcha was strongest than spino... but keep in your fantasy world the only advantage I see is size but only to intimidation no to fight...
Size is not strength? Excuses much?

Then why is an Apatosaurus much much stronger than a Spinosaurus? Size, duh!

And show me proof that Carcharodontosaurus and/or Tyrannosaurus was stronger than Spinosaurus, and I do NOT mean bite force, I mean overall body strength...

And size is a huge factor in a fight, intimidation is a bonus that comes with it...
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Godzillasaurus
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MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 11:13 AM
Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 10:46 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 10:37 AM
It has the power in its body to easily control and push a teensy little 6 ton rex around.
Teensy? You are talking about a dinosaur with one of the largest bite forces in all of history! Livescience.com states that the posterior area of the mandible of an adult tyrannosaurus may range from around 7,000 pounds to around 13,000 pounds of force. Here is the article in case you are interested: [url=/18718-trex-strong-bite.html]Tyrannosaurus Bite Force[/url]
Everything about Tyrannosaurus is small compared to Spinosaurus, except for its bite. I'll give you a scale....

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Which tyrannosaurus reconstruction are you using?
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MightyMaus
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Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 11:21 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 11:13 AM
Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 10:46 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 10:37 AM
It has the power in its body to easily control and push a teensy little 6 ton rex around.
Teensy? You are talking about a dinosaur with one of the largest bite forces in all of history! Livescience.com states that the posterior area of the mandible of an adult tyrannosaurus may range from around 7,000 pounds to around 13,000 pounds of force. Here is the article in case you are interested: [url=/18718-trex-strong-bite.html]Tyrannosaurus Bite Force[/url]
Everything about Tyrannosaurus is small compared to Spinosaurus, except for its bite. I'll give you a scale....

Posted Image
Which tyrannosaurus reconstruction are you using?
It is Shartman's newest Sue reconstruction.
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Godzillasaurus
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MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 11:31 AM
Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 11:21 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 11:13 AM
Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 10:46 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 10:37 AM
It has the power in its body to easily control and push a teensy little 6 ton rex around.
Teensy? You are talking about a dinosaur with one of the largest bite forces in all of history! Livescience.com states that the posterior area of the mandible of an adult tyrannosaurus may range from around 7,000 pounds to around 13,000 pounds of force. Here is the article in case you are interested: [url=/18718-trex-strong-bite.html]Tyrannosaurus Bite Force[/url]
Everything about Tyrannosaurus is small compared to Spinosaurus, except for its bite. I'll give you a scale....

Posted Image
Which tyrannosaurus reconstruction are you using?
It is Shartman's newest Sue reconstruction.
Who is Shartman? I need to read a little bit about this before I come to any conclusions.
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SpinoInWonderland
The madness has come back...
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It seems like Tyrannosaurus would rather use it's head like a battering ram rather than use it's jaws if it wants to survive the battle with Spinosaurus...
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SpinoInWonderland
The madness has come back...
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Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 11:38 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 11:31 AM
Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 11:21 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 11:13 AM
Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 10:46 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 10:37 AM
It has the power in its body to easily control and push a teensy little 6 ton rex around.
Teensy? You are talking about a dinosaur with one of the largest bite forces in all of history! Livescience.com states that the posterior area of the mandible of an adult tyrannosaurus may range from around 7,000 pounds to around 13,000 pounds of force. Here is the article in case you are interested: [url=/18718-trex-strong-bite.html]Tyrannosaurus Bite Force[/url]
Everything about Tyrannosaurus is small compared to Spinosaurus, except for its bite. I'll give you a scale....

Posted Image
Which tyrannosaurus reconstruction are you using?
It is Shartman's newest Sue reconstruction.
Who is Shartman? I need to read a little bit about this before I come to any conclusions.
shartman = Scott Hartman
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Kunfuzzled
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MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 11:13 AM
Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 10:46 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 10:37 AM
It has the power in its body to easily control and push a teensy little 6 ton rex around.
Teensy? You are talking about a dinosaur with one of the largest bite forces in all of history! Livescience.com states that the posterior area of the mandible of an adult tyrannosaurus may range from around 7,000 pounds to around 13,000 pounds of force. Here is the article in case you are interested: [url=/18718-trex-strong-bite.html]Tyrannosaurus Bite Force[/url]
Everything about Tyrannosaurus is small compared to Spinosaurus, except for its bite. I'll give you a scale....

Posted Image
Uhhh why is T.rex missing it's teeth?
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SpinoInWonderland
The madness has come back...
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Kunfuzzled
Jan 24 2013, 12:08 PM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 11:13 AM
Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 10:46 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 10:37 AM
It has the power in its body to easily control and push a teensy little 6 ton rex around.
Teensy? You are talking about a dinosaur with one of the largest bite forces in all of history! Livescience.com states that the posterior area of the mandible of an adult tyrannosaurus may range from around 7,000 pounds to around 13,000 pounds of force. Here is the article in case you are interested: [url=/18718-trex-strong-bite.html]Tyrannosaurus Bite Force[/url]
Everything about Tyrannosaurus is small compared to Spinosaurus, except for its bite. I'll give you a scale....

Posted Image
Uhhh why is T.rex missing it's teeth?
He probably erased them by accident while erasing the background...
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MightyMaus
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brolyeuphyfusion
Jan 24 2013, 12:11 PM
Kunfuzzled
Jan 24 2013, 12:08 PM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 11:13 AM
Godzillaman
Jan 24 2013, 10:46 AM
MightyMaus
Jan 24 2013, 10:37 AM
It has the power in its body to easily control and push a teensy little 6 ton rex around.
Teensy? You are talking about a dinosaur with one of the largest bite forces in all of history! Livescience.com states that the posterior area of the mandible of an adult tyrannosaurus may range from around 7,000 pounds to around 13,000 pounds of force. Here is the article in case you are interested: [url=/18718-trex-strong-bite.html]Tyrannosaurus Bite Force[/url]
Everything about Tyrannosaurus is small compared to Spinosaurus, except for its bite. I'll give you a scale....

Posted Image
Uhhh why is T.rex missing it's teeth?
He probably erased them by accident while erasing the background...
Precisely... white teeth are a pain in the butt to erase around... ;)

BUT, even with his teeth I don't think Tyrannosaurus stands much of a chance.
Edited by MightyMaus, Jan 24 2013, 01:30 PM.
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TheROC
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where does that spinosaurus drawing come from?
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MysteryMeat
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That's a decent drawing, but the tarsus is way too long.
Gotta use images from the same artist if you wanna compare reconstructions.
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