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| South American Giant Short-faced Bear v Andrewsarchus | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jan 13 2012, 10:33 PM (14,644 Views) | |
| Taipan | Jan 13 2012, 10:33 PM Post #1 |
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Andrewsarchus mongoliensis Andrewsarchus mongoliensis was a giant mammalian predator of Central Asia and the largest, and most famous member of the mesonychids, a wholly extinct group of prehistoric mammals. The mesonychids were the only known group of ungulates to become carnivorous, and looked vaguely like wolves, with blunt, hoof-like nails instead of claws. Andrewsarchus (Andrews + Greek ἀñ÷üò, "ruler") was named for the famous explorer and fossil hunter Roy Chapman Andrews, who led the expedition on which it was discovered in 1923. Andrewsarchus is known only from an enormous skull (83 cm long and 56 cm wide) and pieces of bone, but the skull's similarity to that of smaller mesonychids suggests that Andrewsarchus had the same wolf-like body on a larger scale. Extrapolating from the body proportions of similar mesonychids, as well as large land mammals in general, Andrewsarchus was most likely about 4–6 metres (13–18 feet) long, standing nearly 2 metres (6 feet) at the shoulder, and weighing well over 1,500 pounds,[1] making it the largest terrestrial carnivorous mammal known to have ever existed. Based on the proportion comparisons to mesonychids and modern day ursids, it is believed that the largest of the Andrewsarchus may have weighed nearly a ton (close to 2,000 pounds, or 907 kg). It is open to debate whether the animal was gracile or robust in build. It should be noted that modern white rhinoceros specimens are much heavier than these figures, though rhino bodies are about as long. ![]() South American Giant Short-faced Bear - Arctotherium angustidens Arctotherium is an extinct genus of South American short-faced bears within Ursidae of the late Pliocene through the end of the Pleistocene. They were endemic to South America living from ~2.0–0.01 Ma, existing for approximately 1.99 million years. Their closest relatives were the North American short-faced bears of genus Arctodus (A. pristinus and A. simus). The closest living relative would be the Spectacled bear (Tremarctos ornatus). Based on measurements of the fossil's leg bones and equations used to estimate body mass, the researchers say the bear would have stood at least 11 feet tall (3.3 meters) on its hind legs and would have weighed between 3,500 and 3,855 pounds (1,588 and 1,749 kilograms). In comparison, "the largest record for a living bear is a male polar bear that obtained the weight of about 2,200 pounds (1,000 kg)," said researcher Leopoldo Soibelzon, a paleontologist at the La Plata Museum.
Edited by Taipan, Sep 3 2012, 09:02 PM.
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| Molosser | Dec 4 2013, 01:27 PM Post #31 |
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Ursids, Canids, and amphycionids
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Glad to join the forum guys what a magnificent place u have! As for the fight bear hands down, u see it's got superior grappling ability a powerful bite and huge size advantage, the only thing it's opponent may have over it is bite force and perhaps not like I said arctotherium had a powerful bite itself, besides bites won't really mean a lot when you have a giant bear with arms larger than tree trunks and paws the size of a man's chest in front of u, a single swipe to the head would leave any predator in a daze vulnerable to incoming attacks not to mention the machete claws so it's bear hands down, arctodus simus is a better match even simus can win here as well I think |
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| BoomerSooner | Dec 16 2013, 06:38 AM Post #32 |
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Heterotrophic Organism
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SA Short Faced Bear wins here. Andrewsarchus advantages: Stronger bite Arctotherium advantages: Weight disparity, claws, grappling ability A 3500 lb bear is just scary; it was easily the most powerful carnivore of it's time. As long as the bear doesn't take a lot of damage from Andrewsarchus jaws, it should be fine. Edited by BoomerSooner, Dec 17 2013, 02:40 PM.
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| BoomerSooner | Dec 29 2013, 10:19 AM Post #33 |
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Heterotrophic Organism
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deleted
Edited by BoomerSooner, May 16 2014, 02:01 PM.
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| Bob5 | Feb 13 2014, 06:17 AM Post #34 |
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Autotrophic Organism
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The bear was a scavenger that scared away/fought of other predators. The bear would overpower the andrewsarchus, and based on the weights, wouldn't the bear be the largest terrestrial mammalian carnivore? |
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| Bob5 | Feb 22 2014, 06:27 AM Post #35 |
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Autotrophic Organism
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That was probably Prehistoric Predators form Nat Geo, and the experts on Nat Geo were probably 99% right. The bear used its massive size to scare away other predators such as dire wolves, smilodons, and American lions from their kills. |
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| Molosser | Apr 1 2015, 03:38 PM Post #36 |
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Ursids, Canids, and amphycionids
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Arctotherium was the deadliest mammalian land predator that ever lived, andrewsarchus was terrific and very formidable so I'm not counting it out but generally speaking arctotherium takes this. |
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| Ausar | Apr 2 2015, 01:38 AM Post #37 |
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Xi-miqa-can! Xi-miqa-can! Xi-miqa-can!
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![]() That puts Arctotherium's weight at 590 kilograms. On the other hand, Andrewsarchus appears to be ~660 kilograms. Edit: read blaze's subsequent post. Seems this can be at parity. It's pretty safe to assume that the bear was a much better grappler, but attempting to grapple with a head and jaws this proportionately (and absolutely) large would be a very dangerous task. It's not the same as grappling with something armed with horns or tusks. Case in point, lions never attack the head of a crocodile or hippo, they go behind them. In the case of Arctotherium & Andrewsarchus though, nothing suggests the former would be more agile than the latter. Because of this, I favor Andrewsarchus. Edited by Ausar, Jun 18 2016, 06:52 AM.
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| Sleipnir | Apr 2 2015, 05:54 AM Post #38 |
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Steed of the Deathless
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Andrew was considerably more agile, as well.
Edited by Sleipnir, Apr 2 2015, 05:54 AM.
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| Molosser | Apr 2 2015, 03:02 PM Post #39 |
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Ursids, Canids, and amphycionids
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No it wasn't, who told you that? |
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| Sleipnir | Apr 2 2015, 10:24 PM Post #40 |
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Steed of the Deathless
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Walking With Beasts Whale Killer This Andrew could tear up any ursid, but I doubt that pudgy Andrew in the OP could. |
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| Creeper | Apr 3 2015, 12:25 AM Post #41 |
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Carboniferous Arthropod
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That's just one artists interpretation. I prefer them with a pelt and mane. |
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| blaze | Apr 3 2015, 01:35 AM Post #42 |
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Carnivore
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What is this? reverse Jurassic park? being fuzzy makes it more deadly? Andrewsarchus probably looked somewhat like an entelodont not an oversized wolf. |
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| Creeper | Apr 3 2015, 08:04 AM Post #43 |
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Carboniferous Arthropod
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Why would being fuzzy make them more deadly? We have no reason to believe that andrewsarchus or entelodonts were hairless. Having fur doesn't make an animal look like a wolf, it would look like an andrewsarchus with fur, or an entelodont with fur. |
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| Molosser | Apr 13 2015, 01:13 AM Post #44 |
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Ursids, Canids, and amphycionids
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Using a animation documentary to judge an extinct animal, nice. Anyway, there are many old fashion documentaries that give the bear supernatural capabilities. |
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| blaze | Apr 13 2015, 01:52 AM Post #45 |
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Carnivore
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@Creeper Weird, I swear there was a comment to which that response made a little more of sense haha, anyway, the second part of my comment is about what Equus Dreadnoughtus said, the WWB depiction is essentially a giant wolf while the depiction in the op looks more like one would expect from an animal close to the ancestry of both hippos and entelodonts as Andrewsarchus was. |
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