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FelinePowah
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Feb 14 2013, 07:38 AM
Post #76
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- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:21 AM
A bit ironic that you ask for reasoning seeing as your reasoning only goes as far as "it's a cat" Well its not a bad reasoning to have as there bodies are better designed for combat then the dogs body.
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Vivec
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Feb 14 2013, 07:47 AM
Post #77
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Canid and snake enthusiast.
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- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:38 AM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:21 AM
A bit ironic that you ask for reasoning seeing as your reasoning only goes as far as "it's a cat"
Well its not a bad reasoning to have as there bodies are better designed for combat then the dogs body. Because being able to grapple better automatically makes it a better fighter am I right?
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Bandog
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Feb 14 2013, 07:55 AM
Post #78
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Everything else is just a dog.
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- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:38 AM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:21 AM
A bit ironic that you ask for reasoning seeing as your reasoning only goes as far as "it's a cat"
Well its not a bad reasoning to have as there bodies are better designed for combat then the dogs body. Makes it a far more versatile body, yes. Better, no. There is nothing concrete or even highly indicative of cats being better fighters than dogs.
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Vita
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Feb 14 2013, 08:15 AM
Post #79
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- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:35 AM
- k9boy
- Feb 14 2013, 07:23 AM
Well as formidable as this cat is, the staff is too much. Its more powerful, and has the ability to kill the cat much, much quicker then vice versa.
So when SBT fight other dogs do they kill them very very quickly?? its easy to see dog fight videos over the net and one think that doesnt happen is a very very quick fight. If the SBT is of equal weight to the cat then how is it more powerful, where does this extra power come from? A staff is more powerfully built than a caracal, more robust and can grapple using its teeth more effectively. I know you're aware by now that just because two animals are of similar weight, doesn't mean their strength and/or durability is the same as well.
While the caracal can grapple using its limbs, its limbs are weaker compared to this dog. The staff can resist, thus controlling the cat more so than the other way around.
Edited by Vita, Feb 14 2013, 08:16 AM.
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FelinePowah
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Feb 14 2013, 09:23 PM
Post #80
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- K9Crocuta
- Feb 14 2013, 08:15 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:35 AM
- k9boy
- Feb 14 2013, 07:23 AM
Well as formidable as this cat is, the staff is too much. Its more powerful, and has the ability to kill the cat much, much quicker then vice versa.
So when SBT fight other dogs do they kill them very very quickly?? its easy to see dog fight videos over the net and one think that doesnt happen is a very very quick fight. If the SBT is of equal weight to the cat then how is it more powerful, where does this extra power come from?
A staff is more powerfully built than a caracal, more robust and can grapple using its teeth more effectively. I know you're aware by now that just because two animals are of similar weight, doesn't mean their strength and/or durability is the same as well. While the caracal can grapple using its limbs, its limbs are weaker compared to this dog. The staff can resist, thus controlling the cat more so than the other way around. Hold on, if they are both equal weight and cats carry more mucscle to body weight then dogs how is the dog more powerful, please explain to me why the dog is more powerful?? its far to easy to say it just is...... we all know that dogs have robust limb bones and it has nothing to do with strength, the cat will have the more powerful limbs.
What is the bite force for an sbt?
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FelinePowah
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Feb 14 2013, 09:25 PM
Post #81
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- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:55 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:38 AM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:21 AM
A bit ironic that you ask for reasoning seeing as your reasoning only goes as far as "it's a cat"
Well its not a bad reasoning to have as there bodies are better designed for combat then the dogs body.
Makes it a far more versatile body, yes. Better, no. There is nothing concrete or even highly indicative of cats being better fighters than dogs. What its commen sense, if you can use your limbs and jaws in a fight then thats far better then just using jaws.
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Bandog
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Feb 14 2013, 11:15 PM
Post #82
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Everything else is just a dog.
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- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 09:25 PM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:55 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:38 AM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:21 AM
A bit ironic that you ask for reasoning seeing as your reasoning only goes as far as "it's a cat"
Well its not a bad reasoning to have as there bodies are better designed for combat then the dogs body.
Makes it a far more versatile body, yes. Better, no. There is nothing concrete or even highly indicative of cats being better fighters than dogs.
What its commen sense, if you can use your limbs and jaws in a fight then thats far better then just using jaws. Not if you have jaws the same size as a human fetus', skittish temperament and gracile structure. Quite frankly, there are better cats for the job than the caracal.
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FelinePowah
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Feb 15 2013, 12:49 AM
Post #83
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- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 11:15 PM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 09:25 PM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:55 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:38 AM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:21 AM
A bit ironic that you ask for reasoning seeing as your reasoning only goes as far as "it's a cat"
Well its not a bad reasoning to have as there bodies are better designed for combat then the dogs body.
Makes it a far more versatile body, yes. Better, no. There is nothing concrete or even highly indicative of cats being better fighters than dogs.
What its commen sense, if you can use your limbs and jaws in a fight then thats far better then just using jaws.
Not if you have jaws the same size as a human fetus', skittish temperament and gracile structure. Quite frankly, there are better cats for the job than the caracal. Jaws the size of a human fetus?? most wild animals would have a skittish Temperament, most cats are graceful yet very strong, something dogs are not.
Quite frankly this SBT is getting vastly overratted and not one person can give any real reasoning as to why they think the dog is stronger then the cat apart from its limb bones are more robust!!! which in the dog is not an adaption for strength.
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Bandog
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Feb 15 2013, 01:17 AM
Post #84
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Everything else is just a dog.
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- FelinePowah
- Feb 15 2013, 12:49 AM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 11:15 PM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 09:25 PM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:55 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:38 AM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:21 AM
A bit ironic that you ask for reasoning seeing as your reasoning only goes as far as "it's a cat"
Well its not a bad reasoning to have as there bodies are better designed for combat then the dogs body.
Makes it a far more versatile body, yes. Better, no. There is nothing concrete or even highly indicative of cats being better fighters than dogs.
What its commen sense, if you can use your limbs and jaws in a fight then thats far better then just using jaws.
Not if you have jaws the same size as a human fetus', skittish temperament and gracile structure. Quite frankly, there are better cats for the job than the caracal.
Jaws the size of a human fetus?? most wild animals would have a skittish Temperament, most cats are graceful yet very strong, something dogs are not. Quite frankly this SBT is getting vastly overratted and not one person can give any real reasoning as to why they think the dog is stronger then the cat apart from its limb bones are more robust!!! which in the dog is not an adaption for strength. These dogs can get over 30kgs, it will be stronger. How big are the biggest caracals? You live in England right? You must have some experience with a large staffy? They outmuscle dogs twice their size.
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FelinePowah
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Feb 15 2013, 01:50 AM
Post #85
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- Bandog
- Feb 15 2013, 01:17 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 15 2013, 12:49 AM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 11:15 PM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 09:25 PM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:55 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:38 AM
- Bandog
- Feb 14 2013, 07:21 AM
A bit ironic that you ask for reasoning seeing as your reasoning only goes as far as "it's a cat"
Well its not a bad reasoning to have as there bodies are better designed for combat then the dogs body.
Makes it a far more versatile body, yes. Better, no. There is nothing concrete or even highly indicative of cats being better fighters than dogs.
What its commen sense, if you can use your limbs and jaws in a fight then thats far better then just using jaws.
Not if you have jaws the same size as a human fetus', skittish temperament and gracile structure. Quite frankly, there are better cats for the job than the caracal.
Jaws the size of a human fetus?? most wild animals would have a skittish Temperament, most cats are graceful yet very strong, something dogs are not. Quite frankly this SBT is getting vastly overratted and not one person can give any real reasoning as to why they think the dog is stronger then the cat apart from its limb bones are more robust!!! which in the dog is not an adaption for strength.
These dogs can get over 30kgs, it will be stronger. How big are the biggest caracals? You live in England right? You must have some experience with a large staffy? They outmuscle dogs twice their size. Im on about if the caracal and the sbt are of equal size.
I know that STB can get very large i have seen some huge ones and a large staff would probs beat the cat, but im talking at parity.
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Vita
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Feb 15 2013, 03:42 AM
Post #86
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- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 09:23 PM
- K9Crocuta
- Feb 14 2013, 08:15 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:35 AM
- k9boy
- Feb 14 2013, 07:23 AM
Well as formidable as this cat is, the staff is too much. Its more powerful, and has the ability to kill the cat much, much quicker then vice versa.
So when SBT fight other dogs do they kill them very very quickly?? its easy to see dog fight videos over the net and one think that doesnt happen is a very very quick fight. If the SBT is of equal weight to the cat then how is it more powerful, where does this extra power come from?
A staff is more powerfully built than a caracal, more robust and can grapple using its teeth more effectively. I know you're aware by now that just because two animals are of similar weight, doesn't mean their strength and/or durability is the same as well. While the caracal can grapple using its limbs, its limbs are weaker compared to this dog. The staff can resist, thus controlling the cat more so than the other way around.
Hold on, if they are both equal weight and cats carry more mucscle to body weight then dogs how is the dog more powerful, please explain to me why the dog is more powerful?? its far to easy to say it just is...... we all know that dogs have robust limb bones and it has nothing to do with strength, the cat will have the more powerful limbs. What is the bite force for an sbt? It's easy to say it is because it just so happens to be actual. Caracals have scored pretty low in limb strength. (As you already know.)
"Much less is known about the characters that enhance fighting ability, but strength and agility are generally thought to be important in most types of fighting. During fighting, an individual must generate large limb forces to accelerate its body and to manipulate an opponent. Additionally, the direction of force application by limbs is likely to be much more variable during fighting than during running. Thus, stout bones with a circular cross section that can transfer large muscle forces over a large range of motion can be expected to enhance fighting performance. As argued above, high resistance to bone fracture is also expected to improve fighting ability."
This could prove useful for staffs are they are basically the same as pitbull terriers
Regarding a pitbull and greyhound of similar weight:
"Similarly, the pit bull and greyhound limb bone strength study provides additional practical function of robust forelimb bones. Robust forelimb bones can withstand large forces generated by the animal's muscles and an opponent during violent struggles. In addition, more robust limbs are more resistant to bites which can break bones in fights among canids."
http://carnivoraforum.com/topic/9817141/1/?x=25#new
That thread is a good read, you should check it out.
SBT's most likely have a force similar to pitbulls.
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FelinePowah
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Feb 15 2013, 04:15 AM
Post #87
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- K9Crocuta
- Feb 15 2013, 03:42 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 09:23 PM
- K9Crocuta
- Feb 14 2013, 08:15 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:35 AM
- k9boy
- Feb 14 2013, 07:23 AM
Well as formidable as this cat is, the staff is too much. Its more powerful, and has the ability to kill the cat much, much quicker then vice versa.
So when SBT fight other dogs do they kill them very very quickly?? its easy to see dog fight videos over the net and one think that doesnt happen is a very very quick fight. If the SBT is of equal weight to the cat then how is it more powerful, where does this extra power come from?
A staff is more powerfully built than a caracal, more robust and can grapple using its teeth more effectively. I know you're aware by now that just because two animals are of similar weight, doesn't mean their strength and/or durability is the same as well. While the caracal can grapple using its limbs, its limbs are weaker compared to this dog. The staff can resist, thus controlling the cat more so than the other way around.
Hold on, if they are both equal weight and cats carry more mucscle to body weight then dogs how is the dog more powerful, please explain to me why the dog is more powerful?? its far to easy to say it just is...... we all know that dogs have robust limb bones and it has nothing to do with strength, the cat will have the more powerful limbs. What is the bite force for an sbt?
It's easy to say it is because it just so happens to be actual. Caracals have scored pretty low in limb strength. (As you already know.) "Much less is known about the characters that enhance fighting ability, but strength and agility are generally thought to be important in most types of fighting. During fighting, an individual must generate large limb forces to accelerate its body and to manipulate an opponent. Additionally, the direction of force application by limbs is likely to be much more variable during fighting than during running. Thus, stout bones with a circular cross section that can transfer large muscle forces over a large range of motion can be expected to enhance fighting performance. As argued above, high resistance to bone fracture is also expected to improve fighting ability."This could prove useful for staffs are they are basically the same as pitbull terriers Regarding a pitbull and greyhound of similar weight: "Similarly, the pit bull and greyhound limb bone strength study provides additional practical function of robust forelimb bones. Robust forelimb bones can withstand large forces generated by the animal's muscles and an opponent during violent struggles. In addition, more robust limbs are more resistant to bites which can break bones in fights among canids."http://carnivoraforum.com/topic/9817141/1/?x=25#newThat thread is a good read, you should check it out. SBT's most likely have a force similar to pitbulls. But dogs and cats are different.... i think this was posted by someone of the forum..
"Felids show changes in muscle attachment size and leverage that are different from canids (and increase strength) which are not correspondingly reflected in bone strength-or at least by not nearly the same magnitude (not in proportion)."
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Bandog
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Feb 15 2013, 04:19 AM
Post #88
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Everything else is just a dog.
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On the bite force of dogs, I found this.
"Dr. Lehr Brisbin of the University of Georgia states, "To the best of our knowledge, there are no published scientific studies that would allow any meaningful comparison to be made of the biting power of various breeds of dogs."
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Vita
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Feb 15 2013, 04:27 AM
Post #89
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- FelinePowah
- Feb 15 2013, 04:15 AM
- K9Crocuta
- Feb 15 2013, 03:42 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 09:23 PM
- K9Crocuta
- Feb 14 2013, 08:15 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:35 AM
- k9boy
- Feb 14 2013, 07:23 AM
Well as formidable as this cat is, the staff is too much. Its more powerful, and has the ability to kill the cat much, much quicker then vice versa.
So when SBT fight other dogs do they kill them very very quickly?? its easy to see dog fight videos over the net and one think that doesnt happen is a very very quick fight. If the SBT is of equal weight to the cat then how is it more powerful, where does this extra power come from?
A staff is more powerfully built than a caracal, more robust and can grapple using its teeth more effectively. I know you're aware by now that just because two animals are of similar weight, doesn't mean their strength and/or durability is the same as well. While the caracal can grapple using its limbs, its limbs are weaker compared to this dog. The staff can resist, thus controlling the cat more so than the other way around.
Hold on, if they are both equal weight and cats carry more mucscle to body weight then dogs how is the dog more powerful, please explain to me why the dog is more powerful?? its far to easy to say it just is...... we all know that dogs have robust limb bones and it has nothing to do with strength, the cat will have the more powerful limbs. What is the bite force for an sbt?
It's easy to say it is because it just so happens to be actual. Caracals have scored pretty low in limb strength. (As you already know.) "Much less is known about the characters that enhance fighting ability, but strength and agility are generally thought to be important in most types of fighting. During fighting, an individual must generate large limb forces to accelerate its body and to manipulate an opponent. Additionally, the direction of force application by limbs is likely to be much more variable during fighting than during running. Thus, stout bones with a circular cross section that can transfer large muscle forces over a large range of motion can be expected to enhance fighting performance. As argued above, high resistance to bone fracture is also expected to improve fighting ability."This could prove useful for staffs are they are basically the same as pitbull terriers Regarding a pitbull and greyhound of similar weight: "Similarly, the pit bull and greyhound limb bone strength study provides additional practical function of robust forelimb bones. Robust forelimb bones can withstand large forces generated by the animal's muscles and an opponent during violent struggles. In addition, more robust limbs are more resistant to bites which can break bones in fights among canids."http://carnivoraforum.com/topic/9817141/1/?x=25#newThat thread is a good read, you should check it out. SBT's most likely have a force similar to pitbulls.
But dogs and cats are different.... i think this was posted by someone of the forum.. "Felids show changes in muscle attachment size and leverage that are different from canids (and increase strength) which are not correspondingly reflected in bone strength-or at least by not nearly the same magnitude (not in proportion)." Different doesn't mean that certain canids cannot be stronger than particular felids.
From the link provided:
"Small prey specialists do not meet with as much resistance while catching prey. However, their prey is fast and requires speed to catch (Ewer, 1973). The cats that kill small prey have relatively gracile limbs that have a high brachial index (BI), that is, they are relatively distally elongated."
"The cheetah, extant lion and American lion scored much lower than other big cats, such as cougar, snow leopard and clouded leopard. Some small cats had moderately impressive scores while others, such as the serval, Canadian lynx, and African wild cat, were near the bottom of list."
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FelinePowah
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Feb 15 2013, 04:33 AM
Post #90
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- K9Crocuta
- Feb 15 2013, 04:27 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 15 2013, 04:15 AM
- K9Crocuta
- Feb 15 2013, 03:42 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 09:23 PM
- K9Crocuta
- Feb 14 2013, 08:15 AM
- FelinePowah
- Feb 14 2013, 07:35 AM
- k9boy
- Feb 14 2013, 07:23 AM
Well as formidable as this cat is, the staff is too much. Its more powerful, and has the ability to kill the cat much, much quicker then vice versa.
So when SBT fight other dogs do they kill them very very quickly?? its easy to see dog fight videos over the net and one think that doesnt happen is a very very quick fight. If the SBT is of equal weight to the cat then how is it more powerful, where does this extra power come from?
A staff is more powerfully built than a caracal, more robust and can grapple using its teeth more effectively. I know you're aware by now that just because two animals are of similar weight, doesn't mean their strength and/or durability is the same as well. While the caracal can grapple using its limbs, its limbs are weaker compared to this dog. The staff can resist, thus controlling the cat more so than the other way around.
Hold on, if they are both equal weight and cats carry more mucscle to body weight then dogs how is the dog more powerful, please explain to me why the dog is more powerful?? its far to easy to say it just is...... we all know that dogs have robust limb bones and it has nothing to do with strength, the cat will have the more powerful limbs. What is the bite force for an sbt?
It's easy to say it is because it just so happens to be actual. Caracals have scored pretty low in limb strength. (As you already know.) "Much less is known about the characters that enhance fighting ability, but strength and agility are generally thought to be important in most types of fighting. During fighting, an individual must generate large limb forces to accelerate its body and to manipulate an opponent. Additionally, the direction of force application by limbs is likely to be much more variable during fighting than during running. Thus, stout bones with a circular cross section that can transfer large muscle forces over a large range of motion can be expected to enhance fighting performance. As argued above, high resistance to bone fracture is also expected to improve fighting ability."This could prove useful for staffs are they are basically the same as pitbull terriers Regarding a pitbull and greyhound of similar weight: "Similarly, the pit bull and greyhound limb bone strength study provides additional practical function of robust forelimb bones. Robust forelimb bones can withstand large forces generated by the animal's muscles and an opponent during violent struggles. In addition, more robust limbs are more resistant to bites which can break bones in fights among canids."http://carnivoraforum.com/topic/9817141/1/?x=25#newThat thread is a good read, you should check it out. SBT's most likely have a force similar to pitbulls.
But dogs and cats are different.... i think this was posted by someone of the forum.. "Felids show changes in muscle attachment size and leverage that are different from canids (and increase strength) which are not correspondingly reflected in bone strength-or at least by not nearly the same magnitude (not in proportion)."
Different doesn't mean that certain canids cannot be stronger than particular felids. From the link provided: "Small prey specialists do not meet with as much resistance while catching prey. However, their prey is fast and requires speed to catch (Ewer, 1973). The cats that kill small prey have relatively gracile limbs that have a high brachial index (BI), that is, they are relatively distally elongated.""The cheetah, extant lion and American lion scored much lower than other big cats, such as cougar, snow leopard and clouded leopard. Some small cats had moderately impressive scores while others, such as the serval, Canadian lynx, and African wild cat, were near the bottom of list." But the Caracal was classed as a mixed prey specialists..
Caracals are alot tougher then people give them credit.
This caracal defended itself against 2 much larger dogs.
the caracal from the jaws of death, in the form of two highly-motivated, chase Valley boerbuls.
Life yesterday was also cheerier for the caracal, who not only had a bite wound to its right thigh stitched up, but was treated to a little grooming. He had wondered into a private residence in chase Valley where he was met by the owners' dogs. "He is lucky that a small bite is all he came away with, after facing those dogs. We are going to be releaseing him back to the wild in a much better condition than when he arrived, without all the ticks," he said.
http://www.petwise.co.za/live/content.php?Item_ID=434
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