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| Allosaurus fragilis v Yutyrannus huali | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Oct 14 2013, 07:14 PM (5,112 Views) | |
| Taipan | Oct 14 2013, 07:14 PM Post #1 |
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Allosaurus fragilis Allosaurus (play /ˌælɵˈsɔrəs/) is a genus of large theropod dinosaur that lived 155 to 150 million years ago during the late Jurassic period (Kimmeridgian to early Tithonian). Allosaurus was a large bipedal predator. Its skull was large and equipped with dozens of large, sharp teeth. It averaged 8.5 meters (28 ft) in length, though fragmentary remains suggest it could have reached over 12 meters (39 ft). Relative to the large and powerful hindlimbs, its three-fingered forelimbs were small, and the body was balanced by a long, heavy tail. As the most abundant large predator in the Morrison Formation, Allosaurus was at the top of the food chain, probably preying on contemporaneous large herbivorous dinosaurs and perhaps even other predators (e.g. Ceratosaurus). Potential prey included ornithopods, stegosaurids, and sauropods. Allosaurus was a typical large theropod, having a massive skull on a short neck, a long tail and reduced forelimbs. Allosaurus fragilis, the best-known species, had an average length of 8.5 meters (28 ft), with the largest definitive Allosaurus specimen (AMNH 680) estimated at 9.7 meters long (32 ft), and an estimated weight of 2.3 metric tons (2.5 short tons). In his 1976 monograph on Allosaurus, James Madsen mentioned a range of bone sizes which he interpreted to show a maximum length of 12 to 13 meters (40 to 43 ft). As with dinosaurs in general, weight estimates are debatable, and since 1980 have ranged between 1500 kilograms (3300 lb), 1000 to 4000 kilograms (2200 to 8800 lb), and 1010 kilograms (2230 lb) for modal adult weight (not maximum). John Foster, a specialist on the Morrison Formation, suggests that 1000 kg (2200 lb) is reasonable for large adults of A. fragilis, but that 700 kg (1500 lb) is a closer estimate for individuals represented by the average-sized thigh bones he has measured. Using the subadult specimen nicknamed "Big Al", researchers using computer modelling arrived at a best estimate of 1,500 kilograms (3,300 lb) for the individual, but by varying parameters they found a range from approximately 1,400 kilograms (3,100 lb) to approximately 2,000 kilograms (4,400 lb). ![]() Yutyrannus huali Yutyrannus (meaning "feathered tyrant") is a genus of tyrannosauroid theropod dinosaurs from the Early Cretaceous of China. Three specimens of Yutyrannus huali found in the fossil beds of Liaoning Province are currently the largest known dinosaur fossils that preserve direct evidence of feathers. Yutyrannus contains a single type species, Yutyrannus huali, named and described in 2012 by Xu Xing et al. The generic name is derived from Mandarin Chinese yu (羽, "feather") and Latinised Greek tyrannos (τύραννος, "tyrant"), a reference to the classification as a feathered member of the Tyrannosauroidea. The specific name consists of the Mandarin huáli (华丽, "beautiful"), in reference to the beauty of the plumage. Yutyrannus were gigantic bipedal predators. The holotype and oldest-known specimen has a length of 9 metres (30 ft) and an estimated weight of about 1,414 kg (3,120 lb). Its skull has an estimated length of 905 millimetres (35.6 in). The skulls of the paratypes are 80 centimetres (31 in) and 63 centimetres (25 in) long and their weights have been estimated at 596 kilograms (1,310 lb) and 493 kilograms (1,090 lb) respectively. The describers established some diagnostic traits of Yutyrannus, in which it differs from its direct relatives. The snout features a high midline crest, formed by the nasals and the premaxillae and which is covered by large pneumatic recesses. The postorbital has a small secondary process, jutting into the upper hind corner of the eye socket. The outer side of the main body of the postorbital is hollowed out. In the lower jaw, the external mandibular fenestra, the main opening in the outer side, is mainly located in the surangular. ![]() __________________________________________________________________________
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| Daspletosaurus | Oct 15 2013, 02:19 AM Post #2 |
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Heterotrophic Organism
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Pretty close match-up. No extremely large weight or Length differences, going off of A. fragilis and Y. huali so for this fight it should come down to the more effective bit and who has the greater agility (ie. whoever gets the first attack in.). |
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| thesporerex | Oct 15 2013, 07:43 AM Post #3 |
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Kleptoparasite
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I think Yutyrannus would win 54/46 to it probably having a stronger bite and may have been bulkier. But this is very close. |
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| Palaeogirl | Oct 15 2013, 08:07 AM Post #4 |
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Omnivore
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Yutyrannus should be a bit more robust and a likely more dangerous bite. I favor it 55/45. |
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| Carcharadon | Oct 15 2013, 08:37 AM Post #5 |
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Shark Toothed Reptile
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Since when did yutyrannus have a deadlier bite? Theres no study on yutyran's bite force, and i doubt it was bulkier. I would call it roughly a draw against UUVP 6000, as AMNH 680 wins. Edited by Carcharadon, Oct 15 2013, 08:38 AM.
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| theropod | Oct 15 2013, 09:38 PM Post #6 |
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palaeontology, open source and survival enthusiast
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Yutyrannus is very likely not bulkier in the slightest. In fact, their general builts seem quite comparable, yutyrannus actually being a little more elongate. the largest and only adult Y.huali was estimated at about 1.4t, but that doesn't hold up to comparison with Allosaurus that's likely in excess of 2t at a similar lenght. The femur lenght is similar to that of Allosaurus specimen DINO 2560 (likely an average adult), keeping in mind tough that the femur is proportionally a little shorter as this is a more cursorial animal. Except that, there are a few remarkable parallels to carnosaurs and if I remember right someone even speculated it might have been a carcharodontosaur. Without further data, I'd say this is 50/50 against what's probably a normal-sized Allosaurus. Edited by theropod, Oct 15 2013, 09:40 PM.
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| Jinfengopteryx | Oct 16 2013, 02:23 AM Post #7 |
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Aspiring paleontologist, science enthusiast and armchair speculative fiction/evolution writer
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Yeah, 50/50 sounds reasonable. |
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| thesporerex | Oct 18 2013, 07:10 AM Post #8 |
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Kleptoparasite
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That 1.4 ton estimate doesn't sound right for a 9 metre animal, can you show me a link on the weight study? |
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| thesporerex | Oct 19 2013, 10:30 AM Post #9 |
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Kleptoparasite
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I can't imagine how something similar in bulk, length and height could be 0.6+ tons lighter than the simlar carnivore. It sounds impossible! 1000TH MOTHER FUCKING POST!!!!!!!!!!!! FUCK YEAH Edited by thesporerex, Oct 19 2013, 10:33 AM.
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| theropod | Oct 19 2013, 09:12 PM Post #10 |
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palaeontology, open source and survival enthusiast
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The weight estimate was from the description paper (Xu et al.). It bases on a femur-lenght regression, well know to be unreliable (while it seems it is actually still better than femur circumference...). I already stated that it doesn't hold up to comparison with Allosaurus' estimates. Both are of comparable built and size, Allosaurus perhaps less pneumatic and with a deeper body but also a bit shorter. It seems quite likely they are similar in size. |
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| Hatzegopteryx | Oct 29 2013, 03:02 AM Post #11 |
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Unicellular Organism
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I favour Y. huali in this fight about 55/45. Both are nearly the same size, but I believe Y. huali had a stronger bite. It's a close match because both were similar in size terms but I would favour Yutyrannus in this fight. |
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| theropod | Oct 30 2013, 08:49 PM Post #12 |
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palaeontology, open source and survival enthusiast
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^Is there any reason a stronger bite would give it the advantage? Is there even any reason to presume it had a stronger bite? |
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| Bandog | Oct 30 2013, 09:20 PM Post #13 |
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Everything else is just a dog.
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I believe a stronger bite can be a big advantage. A combination of the robust dentition, strong support musculature, heavy skull and neck can give one combatant superior control over its opponent, reducing the capacity to retaliate. A bite designed to slash and cut would be easier to break free from allowing retaliation, even if at the expense of damage. I don't think that's the case here, allosaurus seems to have superior dentition and is somewhat bigger. It should win. |
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| theropod | Oct 30 2013, 10:17 PM Post #14 |
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palaeontology, open source and survival enthusiast
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Allosaurus is not bigger. we only have three yutyrannus, two of which are immatures. the only adult is comparable to the average Allosaurus. A stronger bite is more helpful in controlling an opponent, but both these animals have strong, clawed forelimbs for that exact purpose, so bite force would not be a factor. Plus a single bite would most likely cause letal or at least incapacitating damage anyway, so breaking free (which would increase the damage still) from it is not much of an option. Actually, if one was in the position and state of health to break free from the opponents grip it could just as well simply bite it. |
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| Bandog | Oct 30 2013, 10:53 PM Post #15 |
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Everything else is just a dog.
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With animals like these, I seriously doubt they will be able to restrain each other with the forelimbs. The jaws are the main event and saying bite force would not be a factor in controlling because of the forelimbs is quite untrue. I also disagree on the fatal damage caused by breaking free. There is plenty of evidence to suggest that theropods survive bites to the face (the most likely target). The ability to restrain the killing apparatus is very crucial to avoiding damage. These animals can't restrain each other with just there forelimbs and targeting something other than the head leaves the opponents main weapon free to retaliate. Only massive differences in agility would make it worthwhile to target something other than the head or neck. Keep in mind these comments are referring to animals with big differences in bite strength, these two would seem to have little difference, hence my slight edge to allosaurus due to seemingly superior dentition. |
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