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| Allosaurus fragilis v Yutyrannus huali | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Oct 14 2013, 07:14 PM (5,111 Views) | |
| Taipan | Oct 14 2013, 07:14 PM Post #1 |
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Allosaurus fragilis Allosaurus (play /ˌælɵˈsɔrəs/) is a genus of large theropod dinosaur that lived 155 to 150 million years ago during the late Jurassic period (Kimmeridgian to early Tithonian). Allosaurus was a large bipedal predator. Its skull was large and equipped with dozens of large, sharp teeth. It averaged 8.5 meters (28 ft) in length, though fragmentary remains suggest it could have reached over 12 meters (39 ft). Relative to the large and powerful hindlimbs, its three-fingered forelimbs were small, and the body was balanced by a long, heavy tail. As the most abundant large predator in the Morrison Formation, Allosaurus was at the top of the food chain, probably preying on contemporaneous large herbivorous dinosaurs and perhaps even other predators (e.g. Ceratosaurus). Potential prey included ornithopods, stegosaurids, and sauropods. Allosaurus was a typical large theropod, having a massive skull on a short neck, a long tail and reduced forelimbs. Allosaurus fragilis, the best-known species, had an average length of 8.5 meters (28 ft), with the largest definitive Allosaurus specimen (AMNH 680) estimated at 9.7 meters long (32 ft), and an estimated weight of 2.3 metric tons (2.5 short tons). In his 1976 monograph on Allosaurus, James Madsen mentioned a range of bone sizes which he interpreted to show a maximum length of 12 to 13 meters (40 to 43 ft). As with dinosaurs in general, weight estimates are debatable, and since 1980 have ranged between 1500 kilograms (3300 lb), 1000 to 4000 kilograms (2200 to 8800 lb), and 1010 kilograms (2230 lb) for modal adult weight (not maximum). John Foster, a specialist on the Morrison Formation, suggests that 1000 kg (2200 lb) is reasonable for large adults of A. fragilis, but that 700 kg (1500 lb) is a closer estimate for individuals represented by the average-sized thigh bones he has measured. Using the subadult specimen nicknamed "Big Al", researchers using computer modelling arrived at a best estimate of 1,500 kilograms (3,300 lb) for the individual, but by varying parameters they found a range from approximately 1,400 kilograms (3,100 lb) to approximately 2,000 kilograms (4,400 lb). ![]() Yutyrannus huali Yutyrannus (meaning "feathered tyrant") is a genus of tyrannosauroid theropod dinosaurs from the Early Cretaceous of China. Three specimens of Yutyrannus huali found in the fossil beds of Liaoning Province are currently the largest known dinosaur fossils that preserve direct evidence of feathers. Yutyrannus contains a single type species, Yutyrannus huali, named and described in 2012 by Xu Xing et al. The generic name is derived from Mandarin Chinese yu (羽, "feather") and Latinised Greek tyrannos (τύραννος, "tyrant"), a reference to the classification as a feathered member of the Tyrannosauroidea. The specific name consists of the Mandarin huáli (华丽, "beautiful"), in reference to the beauty of the plumage. Yutyrannus were gigantic bipedal predators. The holotype and oldest-known specimen has a length of 9 metres (30 ft) and an estimated weight of about 1,414 kg (3,120 lb). Its skull has an estimated length of 905 millimetres (35.6 in). The skulls of the paratypes are 80 centimetres (31 in) and 63 centimetres (25 in) long and their weights have been estimated at 596 kilograms (1,310 lb) and 493 kilograms (1,090 lb) respectively. The describers established some diagnostic traits of Yutyrannus, in which it differs from its direct relatives. The snout features a high midline crest, formed by the nasals and the premaxillae and which is covered by large pneumatic recesses. The postorbital has a small secondary process, jutting into the upper hind corner of the eye socket. The outer side of the main body of the postorbital is hollowed out. In the lower jaw, the external mandibular fenestra, the main opening in the outer side, is mainly located in the surangular. ![]() __________________________________________________________________________
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| Bandog | Nov 2 2013, 05:02 AM Post #31 |
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Everything else is just a dog.
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Baboons vs dogs is an interesting analogy but for theropods it is a dangerous game considering that a well placed bite can be fatal whereas dogs need time to thrash or suffocate. I'm not sold on it though. Baboons have proportionately much larger arms than allosaurus, with claws and hands designed to grasp and hold whereas looking at allosaurus' claws lead me to believe they are primarily for slashing. While they maybe able to anchor themselves somewhat, any large animal could likely break free with a few nasty cuts. Given the proximity of the arms to other vital structures, that could be very risky. |
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| Spinodontosaurus | Nov 2 2013, 05:32 AM Post #32 |
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Herbivore
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Not sure about the arms of Allosaurus being used a great deal in combat, at least not against a foe of similar size. Yeah to an extent I'm sure they could use them - but as a 'main' tactic? Having said that, UUVP 6000 is probably just as large, if not larger than Yutyrannus... some of the really large Allosaurus specimens would take this comfortably. Against an Allosaurus like UUVP 6000, Yutyrannus would have had greater top speed (which is essentially irrelevant) due to longer distal limb elements - the other consequence of this is a slightly greater hip height, and would have had a longer skull. However, I doubt it could utilise this as effectively as an allosaurid could - as it doesn't seem to have any obvious adaptions for creating large slash wounds unlike most allosauroids. Conversely, it doesn't seem to be the all out mega-biter that some later tyrannosaurids were either. Yutyrannus being the taller animal is important, as it makes it harder for Allosaurus to utilise it's forelimbs, whilst also making it easier for Yutyrannus to do so itself (because yes, it's arms are very long too). They aren't exactly the kind of dromaeosaur-grade manoeuvrable or megalosaur-grade robust though, so I doubt this is much of an advantage. At near-parity, leaning towards Allosaurus. Factoring in larger (10 meter+) specimens of Allosaurus, the result is pretty obvious. |
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| Bandog | Nov 2 2013, 05:34 AM Post #33 |
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Everything else is just a dog.
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I think I'll stick to that analysis as well. |
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| Jinfengopteryx | Nov 2 2013, 06:07 AM Post #34 |
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Aspiring paleontologist, science enthusiast and armchair speculative fiction/evolution writer
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Haven't you once said that carnosaurs are taller (and less stable) than Edited by Jinfengopteryx, Nov 2 2013, 07:45 AM.
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| Carcharadon | Nov 2 2013, 07:42 AM Post #35 |
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Shark Toothed Reptile
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I don't even see a reason to presume yutyrannus to have a stronger bite, the powerful bone crushing jaws rather evolved in tyrannosauridae, not the more primitive tyrannosauroids like yutyrannus. Or else was this assumed because people kept on getting the message of allosaurus's bite being weak? |
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| theropod | Nov 2 2013, 08:53 PM Post #36 |
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palaeontology, open source and survival enthusiast
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Animals this size will always potentially inflict fatal injuries on each other much more easily than animals that much smaller (ie baboons and dogs). That's probably why we see so many facial injuries as a result of intraspecific fights, because the anterior cranium is still among the least fatal regions. In a fight to the death, I see them exchanging attempts at bites/slashes, preferrably aimed at the neck. Either one inflicts a deciding bite/slash on the other in the course, or one ends up in the other's grasp of jaws and claws, to then have the jaws litterally rip it to pieces while clutching onto it. An analogy to varanid wrestling and feeding could be made here, but with less of the body involved due to size- and posture-related factors. Of course both allosaurids and tyrannosaurs also have a greater specialization for actually hunting and killing stuff than baboons and dogs, but certain aspects of their likely attack strategy are similar. The claws of allosaurids are not sharp on their palmar sides, just pointed at their tips. Its unlikely the arm would be effective at powering the motions needed to slash, since a greater amount of flexibility would be needed. The most likely use it clutching and anchoring, and perhaps stabbing, like komodo dragons or birds of prey. And baboons have no claws at all, do they? Edited by theropod, Nov 17 2013, 09:23 PM.
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| Bandog | Nov 2 2013, 09:05 PM Post #37 |
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Everything else is just a dog.
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Not claws, nails sorry. Same situation though, well designed to grasp. |
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| Vobby | Nov 2 2013, 09:28 PM Post #38 |
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Omnivore
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I completely agree about the clutching-anchoring stuff. About the baboon dog analogy, it could work a little, but it can also be deceiving. For example, baboons slash each other, but they don't have the same teeth, neither the same neck of Allosaurus, so the two of slashing should be quite different. Same thing for the canid analogy, but it could work a little better IMO. (I'll make the thread) |
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| retic | Nov 6 2013, 01:50 AM Post #39 |
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snake and dinosaur enthusiast
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allosaurus wins since it is larger and it has a deadlier bite. |
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| Soopairik | Oct 16 2017, 09:11 AM Post #40 |
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Carnoferox's sex toy
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Allosaurus wins thanks to its strong arms, speed, and a terrific bite to top it off. |
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